Perhaps a step too far, but it’s as good as true.
SF4 didn’t copy or steal the name, they used a relatively basic adjective that was once used by a then-defunct franchise. If the old KI games were as great as the nostalgic fanbase would have us believe, it wouldn’t have taken 20 years to resurrect the franchise.
I think a better way of saying this is the lack of a history for KI.
…then again it did get to skip over the awkward years where the industry was trying to turn every FG into a Virtua Fighter clone. We are probably fortunate they waited until SF & MK went back to their roots (MK moreso) with SF4 & MK9 and really started perfecting 2d gameplay with 3d graphics.
you mean story, right? Anyway, it seems you like SF the most. KI Ultra Combos still awesome. Its KI signature. I would hate to have KI game without ultra combo and if IG bring ultimates i can see the mountain of salt that will be around this game. Please IGS staff, not everything need to be politically correct.
I wholly agree with this. I’m glad KI got to hibernate through that long winter of FG’s. However, did they actually have choice? Were they truly “waiting,” or was their product simply fiscally unviable? I’m not trying to ruffle too many feathers, but I’m quite certain it was the latter.
No, I mean the history of success (or lack thereof) of the original KI games. I care very little for the story of FG’s in general. Do these people have a reason to thrash each other? Good enough for me.
I’m not arguing against Ultra’s! They should absolutely remain, and I agree that they are indeed a part of KI’s identity. And, honestly, I’m sort of pro-Ultimate too (so long as they are just cinematic counterparts to Ultra’s). It’s the wasting of a strangers time to validate one’s own expenditure at their cost that I’m against.
Not sure what political correctness has to do with anything, unless you’re implying that Orchid should flash her opposition, to which I can only shake my head. That’s not about PC, that’s about basic human decency and growing together as a community, as opposed to making a mockery of our “strong independent female role model” types.
And, for the record - these days I actually like KI the most. I grew up on Guilty Gear and MvC2. Played a ton of SFA3 on Dreamcast, then didn’t touch SF until SF4. I’ve also played lots of Tekken and Soul Calibur, but the period of time where SF was my main game was comparatively small. Also, to hell with SF5 (despite being a Charlie fanboy since '98).
I agree with that. I’ve played all KI games from the past both in arcade and consoles and even with all the incredible things KI had it was not my first option because the game was absurdly hard to play and understand (with the same amount of coins i could waste on KI, i would play at least the double of time in other fighting games). I loved the game but i had more frustrations with it than good memories.
When i got my hands on the new KI, i felt a completely different set of emotions, it had every thing that amused me from the past and i didn’t got the frustration of not being able to understand it.
I miss KI gold team elimination with ultras/ ultimates
It was more in legal limbo than it was nobody wanted to make one or thought it wouldn’t sell. Rare during the latter N64 years seemed more content with making mostly kid-friendly Mario 64 clones, and then MS bought them out for their “kid ffriendly” aspect, and later decided Rare should be their Kinect game makers, so KI really didn’t fit within MS’s trying to brand Rare as their Nintendo-like branch.
…plus there was the failed Killer Instinct Fox cop drama…or whatever it was…
That never should have happened.
As to the rest of your point, it seems like a lot of bureaucracy ultimately deciding that KI was not marketable. Whatever the reason may be, if it were perceived as profitable in it’s climate by it’s owners, it would have existed again. There were extenuating circumstances (like MS’s vision of Rare games as “kid friendly”), but if the men with the money had seen a worthwhile potential profit margin, they certainly could have revived it - they could even have made it kid-friendly. Hell, this iteration of KI is relatively kid friendly (not quite SF, but moreso than MK or even GG). If I recall, MK was marketed directly to children in the early 90’s - wasn’t there a commercial with two young lads? But they didn’t, because their vision at the time didn’t translate to KI being worth the expenses. It took 20 years (minus the time crafting it before release, I dunno how long it took) for someone(s) with capital to see potential for investment, and when it returned, it is aesthetically (and gameplay) very different than it predecessors. I don’t think these things are necessarily coincidental.
What? Violates the togetherness? It’s a fighting game where my goal is to have fun and try to win.
This can go the other way too, should I sacrifice my enjoyment of Ultra combo’s because they value their time over mine? They can choose to not like ultra’s as much as I like them. If I lose my opponent can choose to ultra or not, just like when I win I can choose to ultra or not. That part of it isn’t really debatable. The only part that is is whether or not it is disrespectful. I do an ultra because I like how they sound, they look cool, the announcer sound is awesome, it is part of the nostalgia why I first found Killer Instinct at an arcade when I was a kid. Has nothing to do with my opponent. The only reason an Ultra would be disrespectful is if you choose to let it be.
There is a reason it took 20 years, and it wasn’t that the fanbase wasn’t there for it. Nintendo owned rare at the time of KI2, Nintendo wanted more Banjo Kazooie games and other games to come out over a fighter so it got pushed back, then Microsoft bought rare hoping to get DKC rights but didn’t so they basically put rare on the back burner. You’d have to look into it if you want to know all of it, I’m not writing out 20 years of why it wasn’t made but it’s mostly due to being pushed to make other things instead.
First, I would like to note the distinct difference between an Ultra and 3xUltra. They are not the same. If one whole Ultra rocks, okay. You still could’ve saved us 5 seconds, but that beat is usually sick, so I’ll accept the disco stick.
Is playing the game not fun? Is victory simply “not fun enough”? It’s not fun until you get to the part where you’re no longer playing, but putting on a performance? When only the performer appreciates the performance, it’s still satisfying?
That’s all well and good. That’s why people do Ultras. That’s why there are youtube reels of them. They are entertaining. I am talking about multiple, sequential, ultras.
Are you playing a multiplayer game to be entertained, or are you playing the game to experience a battle of minds and dexterity against another human? The distinction here is subtle, sure, but they are different.
If playing the game and the expenditure of time has nothing to do with your opponent, why is your “reward” for victory a minute of their life? Really, if playing the game has nothing to do with your opponent, why aren’t you playing single-player?
And, again, to the point of KI’s 20 year hiatus, there sure is a lot of corporate history to it. Endeavors perceived as highly profitable don’t just wind up on the back-burner long enough for their original fanbase to have children, or grandchildren.
So your enjoyment of Ultras is actually more important than the time of a stranger, to you. This is exactly why there is a single player mode. There is even a single player mode that seeks to imitate real people so you don’t have to waste real people’s time. Moments of a strangers life should not be an entertainment commodity - and if you make them such, at least acknowledge that you are devaluing that individual for nothing other than your own entertainment, and accept that that outlook is in fact disrespectful. You don’t have to insult someone to disrespect them.
It might sound dumb, but there is a measure of sanctity to gaming as a human endeavor. It saddens me to see an era where people value that so little.
That’s just it, they don’t want me to do something while I want to do something. I love the game so I accepted the fact that if I sucked bad enough in a round that someone could save their resources and triple ultra me, I guess I get triple ultra’d I don’t mind as long as I get a rematch. I don’t care what people do in a match really, I dislike people who leave when they lose or are about to lose. Single, double or triple it doesn’t bother me. I accept that it can or can’t happen in any upcoming match I play, that is just something that is inevitable. Those that choose to not accept it, will complain about them. Then they will complain about my wanting to do them as well. Then they call into question my arguments when they are making the very same argument, mine is no more significant. Fact of the matter is, it will happen or not, nothing will change about the future of Ultra’s being in the game or not. The only thing now is, the small community of S1 vs the large community of S3, People who are set in the S1 days of no ultra or small ultra need to move up to the current. KI is many many many times larger than it was when we had a roster of 8. Pc community was added too. I’ve seen more new players last week than I could have hoped to come across in the beginning months of S2.
It does when Nintendo or Microsoft are involved. The reason MK and SF continued, is because their developers were their own, they produced multiplat games without the primary console backer calling the shots. Rare was owned by Nintendo at the time, so they can pitch ideas, but Nintendo gives them games to make not the other way around.
People don’t want you to waste their time, while you want to waste their time, when instead of wasting their time, you could be watching all the super neato juggles you can muster in single player.
You love the game so you accepted that a loss means the opponent can artificially delay the amount of gameplay you get out of a given session, with no guarantee of a rematch, and so everyone should accept that the victor gets to decide whether you can squeeze in another match tonight or not?
Those that choose to value their time with the game itself (not with it’s superfluous aesthetic installations) will complain about having that time limited or wasted by a stranger, then will complain about you wanting to waste or limit their game-time. Then they’ll call into question your argument that you are entitled to waste their time, which is decisively less significant than your singular enjoyment of extraneous aesthetics, on the premise that it is possible to waste their time AND you enjoy doing so, and thus they should just buck up and deal.
People need to adapt to having their time wasted in a fashion that has literally zero bearing on gameplay, aside from how much you get to participate in per session?
As a S3 player, I still think it’s rude to waste someone elses time with meaningless self-gratification. If other people’s time means so little, you could not waste it at all and just watch yourself play out impractical or unfeasible but hella stylie combos in single player.
I haven’t seen one counterpoint yet, aside from “my enjoyment of redundant animations and music trumps the value of another persons time because they’re in the game,”. If anyone is capable of providing an alternate counterpoint to the validity of multi-Ultra vs. a random stranger, please provide it, because the above is nothing but self-centeredness driving disrespect.
I’m pretty sure everyone accepts that long multi-Ultra sequences aren’t going anywhere. Just because something exists doesn’t mean it is always appropriate.
How about the xp and fight challenges?
That is the weakest of counterarguments, but okay, considering it is the only other counterpoint I’ve seen. XP and fight challenges. @BigBadAndy did us the kindness of pointing out that Ultra>INSX>Ultra>Ender yields similar enough results for a trivial time differential. Further, the same XP and challenge rewards are available in single-player, where you can grind to your hearts content without wasting a single persons time.
Do people seriously grind the “fight challenges” of all things? Against humans?
I don’t usually do it online (apart from the Ranked and Exhibition fight challenges obviously), but it is probably the best way of getting XP.
After 100 vs matches and 50 survival matches (which basically means I’ve got the Supreme Victories out of the way) I’ve usually got most of the easier fight challenges out of the way, with at least decent progress on Ultras Performed, Combo Hits Enders, Specials, etc.
It did me wonders on my road to getting all the characters to 50. I used a similar strategy back when I got Master Prestige in Black Ops 2. It’s a pretty common grinding strategy across most games, from my experience.
I appreciate that you took the time to actually answer that.
It was supposed to be rhetorical, but you got me.
Not trying to be rude, but I still think grinding is a pretty weak excuse to waste someone’s time, considering the plethora of single-player modes available.
If the triple ultras were followed by a PM like “soz bro, you know the grind!” I guess it could dampen the annoyance in the short-term. It would at least be polite. I imagine this isn’t often (if ever) the case.
Fighting against the cpu lul.
I will say this, whether you think it’s a weak counterpoint or not I’ll have to leave to you, but in all honesty when you fight a random player online, you have no way of knowing their feelings on the matter of Ultras or multi-Ultras. For all anyone knows when they get matched up, that person may be wanting to learn how to do as long of multi-ultras as they can do, but haven’t seen what is possible with a particular character. You’re going off several assumptions that the other player has seen them all, is sick of them, thinks it’s insulting to perform them, has very limited time…cares… and considering that with any random fight you quite honestly don’t know their preference one way or the other, or the other, or that other one, you can try to assume they just want to cut it short and move on, but end up with no different results than if you don’t cut things short. In most cases you’ll never know one way or the other, unless they message you to let you post-match to express their opinion on how you handled your win. And considering that there is no way of knowing, why make assumptions? Just play the game in a way that you enjoy, and if the opponent really is disgusted with your choice, the game allows a free no-penalty opt-out (IIRC disconnect penalties end when an ultra starts).
So like I said, why should someone concern themselves with wasting another player’s time when A: you don’t know if they even care or B. if they don’t like it they can drop out with no penalty?
99.99% of people playing don’t want to see their opponent do super long ultras. If they did they would go on youtube and see the longest ultra for each character. It’s not rocket science.
In life, it’s common courtesy to assume people will not want their time wasted, and to do your best to avoid doing so.