Event hubs is covering it to, but again it is a rumor.
Even max talks about it
Interesting vid, although I could care less about net code tbh. Iād rather have a good, if not great game with a terrific story, gameplay, soundtrack and art design than just being able to play online. I donāt mind if some elements were changed in the combat, just because KI2013 already deviated pretty largely from the originals in terms of how the characters played. I just hope the changes are such that it doesnāt negatively impact the game itself.
NET CODE IS VITAL.
If there is one thing weāve learned going forward in a time where online tournaments are vital and online gameplay is the overwhelming option of choice, and in person tournaments run the risk of passing sickness, itās that fighting games should be held to a new, better standard of online play.
It may not seem like much to you, but if you try to play older games like MvC3, and even a modern one like Dragonball FighterZ, and you donāt have good netcode, youāll run into frame delays, stuttering, and other issues that make online impossible. This makes it worse for communities to gather around an otherwise good game, and it will see its player base decline. There are tourney players who literally stopped playing tournaments of games because the online for their game is so subpar, competing is nigh untenable.
Itās the reason why the FGC, Max being a very big vocalist of the subject, have started calling for companies to start adopting rollback and improving the online experience. KI may not have been what it is today without having the online netcode it does. Itās something you may take for granted if this is the only fighting game you play, but if youāve played them as long as some of us have, itās a VERY big deal. Launch MK 10 versus the final product are two different games online for this very reason. It was a very big, expensive gamble for Nether Realm Studios at the time, but it worked, and theyāve gone with rollback ever since.
As for KI 2013, I like the core of it as it is, but there are a few charactersā design philosophies I feel break the gameās meta is some degenerative ways, and itās why I think thereās an emergence of a few overall characters floating to the top of the roster.
Point taken. For myself, though, I donāt care about netcode or online - all I care about as a fighting game fan is, does the game look, play and sound good, if not great? Does the game have a character/characters that I like? Do the characters stand out? Is the story interesting and something that I want to learn more of? When I do inputs, does it feel satisfying to pull off? What are the mechanics of the game itself? While there is somewhat of a subjective element here, those are valid concerns nonetheless for a fighting game. I will wholeheartedly admit to liking the graphic design of a game like āRise of the Robotsā, but if a game is such a POS that it makes playing unbearable, no amount of netcode in the world is going to save it. I played āRise 2ā out of curiosityās sake, but J esus that game was awful to play, which is a shame.
Do you mostly play your fighting games offline? A local scene?
Generally I prefer playing fighting games offline. KI is probably my first online experience as far as fighting games are concerned, but even then, I never use online matches. Iām just not into that sort of thing.
We should actually be getting Max on the podcast this week
But yes, I had been told just over a year ago that āKI isnāt deadā. But my source clarified that the game at the time wasnāt in active development, but just re-assured me that Phil wasnāt done with KI.
Phil later confirmed this himself (around December 2020 if memory serves?)
It was a separate source that has since told me the game is in active development and weāre trying to find out who the studio is.
Okay so we donāt know who the studio is, but hopefully its someone who can do it well.
The quyestion is, what happens next. We know that gargos is locked up with Aganos in the comics. (Unless thatās not canon.)
Theyāll merge and become Agarnos.
There is still that group of vampires that they will have to deal with. No doubt ultratech would be up to no good either.
I personally really hope it isnāt canon. It did set up the next part of the story but Iād really like if it gets redone somehow
Never say never ig
Or Garganos. With cannons. 
Iād honestly prefer if theyād retcon that part away tbh, just because I HATED that. Iād rather a different boss.
Undoubtedly.
The one character Iāam definatly hoping returns is Riptor. I have confidence that Glacius and Sabrewulf will come back. No problem.
Same here.
Definitely. Theyāre legacy characters, so theyāre bound to come back.
Love seeing all of these rumors, even if some of them should be taken with a grain of salt (or an entire truckās worth, lol).
But yeah, this would be awesome, and I hope the additional rumor about a larger budget pans out as well. Hopefully Phil Spencer, Matt Booty and the other decision makers saw that this was a viable franchise with a dedicated fanbase that helped keep it going for four years and the more quality titles they have across as many genres as possible, the better, especially when trying to sell people on a subscription model.
Anyways, in terms of my hopes and dreams for a new KI game, Iād say:
-No MS character fighter: In other words, sure, have some guests. But donāt turn KI in to MS Smash Bros. You want that game, make that game. Thatās not KI and itās not what KI should be turned in to.
-Do NOT reboot the story: You did that already and it made sense to do so. Now you have a narrative through line that stretched from season one all the way through the KI comics. Thereās no need to retcon all of that. Start off where the comics ended. Gargos is gone, but the damage he wrought on a near-destroyed, post-apocalyptic world remains. Pick up from there.
-Do NOT time jump: I donāt want to see Jago and Orchid in their 50ās and TJ Comboās son as main characters, nor do I want to see the story have to do backflips to justify why some characters are still around. I believe the comic jumped forward a little bit, but not alot. Thatās fine. Thatās enough.
-Use more of the character types that were talked about prior to season 3 as ideas for new characters: I know IGās not making this game, but there were a lot of fun ideas that were talked about back then that a new team could develop and expand upon; a Lovecraftian character, a djinn, a witch, an MMA fighter, a mercenary / military type, etc.
-Do NOT bring back Gargos, Eyedol, Rash, Arbiter, RAAM, Omen and use one version of Hisako only: Definitely donāt repeat guests unless you plan to fully integrate them in to the story. Also, with Gargos gone, the characters that tie to him the most, Eyedol and Omen, can probably sit this one out. Not saying they canāt come back in a future sequel, but itās time to tell the next story and they donāt overly need to be in it. Iām not including Shago because honestly, Iād like to see what an alternate, corrupted version of Jago becomes when his masterās gone.
-If they go the seasonal route again, you have to start with more than six characters: While it was great to really get eyeballs deep in those six before the next characters started rolling out, itās still not enough. Iād say maybe start with 12-15.
-Keep the content faucet on for years: This was the one of the best decisions by MS. Having a great game that lasted for four years and gave players a new character and stage or mode etc to look forward to every month or two was awesome. Keep it going until you have maybe 35-40 characters. That could obviously take years, and thatās kinda the point.
-Create or purchase a Killer Instinct team: Not really about the game itself, and while I donāt mean to sound dismissive of any other titles, but if certain games can get a dedicated team within MS, then I think KI is deserving if its own team. Either spin it up with James Goddard in the lead role and whoever MS can lure over from Double Helix, Iron Galaxy, Netherealm or other studios or purchase a studio that can properly realize a sequel to the last KI. Iām not just saying it because I love this series. This is a quality franchise that deserves a dedicated team. Maybe they also work on reviving Tao Feng or Kakuto Chojin as well if theyāre able to handle two games at once.
-Make the story linear: Back to the game itself. While I loved all the story content Adam Isgreen dreamt up for this game, the fact that it was presented as multiple endings in the first season, Twisted Metal style vignettes (beginning, middle and end) in the second season and then largely presented through sporadic cutscenes, intro dialog, mission info etc in ShadowLords in the third season plus the novella, PLUS the comics wasā¦ A bit disjointed. I still LOVED what we got and I love that Adam took the time and had the creativity to come up with so much for these characters, but we need a story mode and we need an arcade mode where the endings are canon. If you want to do a comic, great. But it shouldnāt be so tough to find story and then try and put it all together.
-Bring back ShadowLords: Yes, I know that might be a hot take, but I loved this mode. At least according to James, I was the first person that he knew of that got the full 107% completion of it. So yeah, I dug it. Thing is, this HAS to be supported by continual story and content drops. It canāt be a āthis has so much potential to be grown outā idea that never gets grown out. This can ABSOLUTELY be the gameās story mode to start off with, and it can have some roguelike elements that increase the more you play through it, and you can keep continuing the story through new missions and that add more depth to the characters and their motivations all ending with a massive Killer Instinct Tournament update that puts a period on the story when the gameās ready to end. Or you can have the main story come to an end in the original content drop and simply tell stories that happen after the initial ending.
-Expand characterās move lists: A bit nitpicky, but adding a bit more variety to the animations and the differences between light, medium and heavy versions of a motion might be nice, like how Sabrewulf had different stuff that he did off of his run, or how back forward and a button did something different depending on the strength. I know a lot of characters had this, but some didnāt. Jagoās wind kick, for example, was only different in the distance it traveled.
-More archetypes: KI was great at giving us a variety of fighting game archetypes, which was all the more interesting given that they all adhered to the same core combo system. But yeah, give me a puppet character, give me a character that can continue combos on the ground, give me a character that can do far more combo-wise while in the air than even Sadira, give me a resource manager, give me a character with multiple stance changes like ARIA, but expand the stances even further, give me a drunken kung fu fighter. I know itās over done and I know itās not so much an archetype as a genre mainstay, but Iād love to see how KI would handle this type of character.
-Do NOT ditch the counter breaker: This one idea took KIās system from a combo breaker fest that made watching matches okay, but not great, in to a virtual chess match that had me on the edge of my seat. If there are other ways to expand the two way nature of combos in KI, Iād love to see a new dev team explore them, but the counter breaker should be just as ubiquitous or even synonymous with KI as the combo breaker. Itās essential.
-Bring back announcer Mike: I donāt know if he still works for Double Helix and I donāt know if itās even possible for him to be hired for some side work on this game, but FFS, his voice in season one was just PERFECT.
-Bring back Mick Gordon: I know there has been some stuff said about him and the relationship he had with the Doom team and how that all ended, but this guy is such a great fit for the creative ways in which KI employed music in KI 2013. He knew how to compose absolute bangers regardless of the genre and that type of jack-of-all-trades ability would be great for a sequel.
-Donāt be afraid to experiment: Sure, there will likely be push back, but while this should be a sequel to the last game that hopefully carries forward the best ideas and concepts created or evolved upon in the last title, it should also expand and create new characters, new story directions, new fighting mechanics, etc. If fans only want the last game, well, that game exists and can be played. Give us some new ideas, and if you think some of the older stuff doesnāt work that well, like youāre not wild about flipouts or you think something is needlessly complex or whatever, then change it, rebuild it, improve upon it. If you want shadow moves to be black/mirror-ish type moves again, then do it, if you want to eliminate shadow moves entirely because you think you have a better idea to replace them? Go for it.
-Work with the fans, not against them: While I just said about to use all the creative license you want, one thing that made KI truly special is the way in which the devs interacted with fans and really took their advice in to consideration. Sure, you can take a Harada ādonāt ask me for ā ā ā ā ā mentality or you can put up a virtual wall between yourselves and the fans like Netherealm does and throw out a āweāre always looking at fan feedbackā line on Twitter here and there, but asking fans questions here, on this board, showing us ideas, changing things and tweaking things while youāre the process can honestly help make this a better game. KI has some great fans, and on there the fans tend to be largely positive, and many of us would want to help and contribute and know fighting games well and can give you that immediate feedback or focus group response you might need.
At the end of the day, I want a dev that will make their vision of Killer Instinct, but I also think that the last game was so phenomenal, so creative and innovative, that thereās a lot that would be worth carrying forward in terms of ideas and concepts, but also in terms of how they handle the fans, how they handle returning characters, the release model, etc.
Weāll see if any of this comes to fruition. Iām sure Iām months, if not years early on the āhereās what I want a KI sequel to beā post but oh well. There you have it, in all its overwritten, giant paragraphed glory lol.
Absolutely.
I donāt mind if they do, but ideally speaking, Iād want them to iron out the wrinkles, if not flesh stuff out in the story. I think KI2013 storywise has nuggets of absolute brillianceā¦but at other times it really falls flat, stumbles and, at its worse, kind of s hits itself. I mean, Jagoās crisis of faith - thatās a fascinating direction, or Sabrewulf suffering the trauma of removing the cybernetic limbs, etc.
ā¦But then comes questionable changes like making Sabrewulf a gluttonous moron who cut himself by accident, or taking Orchidās mystique by kind of giving her an origin. Iād rather they not make the comic canon, if not only use very, VERY slight elements from it, just because it was pretty bad. But yeah, a near-destroyed, post-apocalyptic world Iād be fine with.
I am definitely in favor of more characters, just so long as they make sense, that they look and play well, and that they have really good stories.
This.
We definitely need a storymode for KI, albeit one that is much less disjointed. One of the problems I have with KI2013 as a game is that it is very disjointed in its narrative, as during S1 there was a very strong sense of this being a continuation of sorts to KI2, but S2 onwards, itās more KI1 onwards, making it incredibly confusing. It really felt like two different studios had two very different takes for the story. Ideally, Iād want a story that would be able to comprehensively link KI1 to 2013 without necessarily having to contradict whatās already there.
Iām not crazy about SL tbh. I mean, it was an interesting mode, but it seemed like one predicated on having way, WAY more in the way of characters, stages, cinematics, etc and that IG bit off more than they could chew with the limited budget they had. Itās an interesting idea, but not something Iād want to see revisited. It also didnāt help that there was some downright awful writing in some of the character interactions.
Parts of this I agree, parts of this I donāt. Personally I want all of the characters back. They donāt have to be a cannon part of the narrative to be worth bringing back. Story is important, but imo they should build the story around the roster and not build the roster around the story. I really did not like shadow lords and to me it just kind of feels like wasted resources. But beyond that I agree with most of whatās here.