[quote=“BigBadAndy, post:7, topic:17468”]
There’s a huge gulf between people who care about this and people who don’t. I’m not sure why so many of the folks interested in offline tournaments can’t understand that some people just don’t care about that - but still love the game. If you play KI on your couch with your buddies you may never have heard of EVO let alone care how many tournament entries SF V gets. KI has a legacy. The offline tournament scene is one facet of the game’s community (and that’s great) but people need to remember there are lots of other facets
[/quote]Exactly, the vast majority of players don’t even know KI has a pro scene let alone attends offline events yet the players who do treat the other 99% like they’re idiots for not being all about what they’re into. Newsflash folks, the pro scene is the minority.
But they’re the loudest and have the most reach…dundundunnnnnnn.
I am just here to say we usually purposefully allow you to have these conversations, and let them continue without our words because you are all entitled to your own thoughts. Not even saying some are wrong/some are right. They are all different, and no two people fit the same mold.
I can tell you that the next release will be a little different than this one, as well. Will it be perfect for everyone? Nah. But in the KI-spirit, we are looking to continue to shake things up.
As always, your and the team’s engagement with us as a community is appreciated. Even if you don’t or can’t chime in, it’s really nice to know that our voices and opinions are actually being read and considered - that’s an incredibly rare thing for any community to be able to say.
Agreed, at least they are reading our concerns, even if they don’t say anything.
That much is appreciated.
In this case there isn’t right or wrong, there are differents points of view.
And I´m really glad to know that you all are always here taking our opinion to consideration.
Thank you one more time.
I’m sorry, but it’s a rip. The 50% to the tournament fund is a cop-out because MS doesn’t want to fund tourneys anymore because they’ve stopped giving a damn about us. Plain and simple.
All other characters with the exception of Shago (who at least came with KI Gold) were $5 and Kilgore is a reskin (with some work put into him, don’t get me wrong) so he should have cost less to make. So to charge double the normal price is ludicrous.
Because of the pricing, funding the tourney is not an excuse because the money going to the tourney is the extra $5 being added on top of the usual $5 price. The easy way to resolve this is to sell the character for $5, and a tourney support character bundle for $10 with either some KI Gold or a cool skin. But IG is determined to fund tourneys with other people’s money as aggressively as possible, I guess.
Honestly, the best idea would have been to do this 50% tourney cut thing with the skin packs that just came out, surely they weren’t THAT hard/expensive to make, and they’d incentivize sales of a bunch of skins that a lot of people weren’t going to bother buying anyway. This would follow the example of MKX which I thought was a good approach and that worked for them. But at this point, I’d settle for the (revised) Shago solution I mentioned.
Don’t get me wrong though, I’m okay with these characters not being free for S3/Definitive purchasers. I expected each character to be $5, with the bundle for all 3 maybe being $10 or something (would have been an instabuy in that case). I get that these characters are an attempt to further fund Shadow Lords/cool stuff like Ultimates and that’s fine. I even get that the skin packs (which are arguably a bigger rip-off imo, but at least they’re purely cosmetic) were made for this purpose. But this is too much.
Until this moneygrab is sorted, I’m personally not giving any more money to IG. Unlike skins, it’s not right to hold characters hostage like this. Vote with your wallets people.
/rant
Loud and reach. Got it 
Are they though? I don’t see very many pro players here, day after day talking about Killer Instinct.
I have art in the sticks. Because it’s not a cabinet per se there isn’t really a marquee or prominent sides to put art on. I could probably get something out on the compartment lid but I haven’t really thought about it yet.
Yes that’s precisely my point.
Well, yeah they are. Think of it this way - if each “pro” has just ten followers and plays the game on a stream for one day a month that’s a lot more “reach” than I have, even as a super fan. I have bought copies of the game for three people and talked two other people into buying it. Chances are most of these pros have put the game in front of more people than me - as an individual. So yeah, they are louder and have more reach as individuals. And I would never say MS should ignore them. It’s great that they address that community. I think it’s a valued one.
But what we’ve been talking about is how that handful of people and their individually magnified reach stacks up against everybody else. And it’s not a contest - the mob of casuals is the dominant force. The debate has not (for me) been around whether MS should support the tournament scene, it’s whether it makes sense to tell the mob of casuals (for lack of a better term - and this includes me) that it’s great for us if WE support offline tournaments. That part still eludes me. I’m not against them - I’m not arguing against tournaments. I’m just suggesting that asking me to support tournaments by purchasing Kilgore is a poor choice.
One more piece - I used the quote from @xCrimsonLegendx to slide in to the conversation. This is not me saying “x happened” or “this is the way it is.” Just chiming in on a discussion as old as games themselves.
Reposted partly for more visibility and more relevant thread
"A lot of people if I have noticed don’t actually like the idea of a community fund for the tournament scene. Which is weird to me. It’s almost like they didn’t expect to be asked for a donation for the tournament scene preferring to just donate to in game content.
My question is why did people expect any different the shago community fund was exactly like this one except except instead of getting a charecter you got a skin, some gold and the hope that if enough people bought the fund ig will actually give the skin you got a new moveset.
Any way after thinking on it I think it’s because somehow people equated “community fund” to give funds to devs so they can make ingame content we want instead of donate to the tournament scene when you buy this in game content. (Even I am guilty of this because I keep saying shago fund as if the money was going to fund shago but the thing is IT ISNT it all went to the tournament pot bonus for online and offline play. The shago moveset was only a promise, a way to see just how many people wanted shago to be a real boy)
I swear someone in Microsoft office is scratching their head wondering why is there such a division in the fan base about this, they cut the entire price in half(it used to be 20$), garenteed a charecter instead of a skin and maybe an upgrade to a charecter if an arbitrary amount of money is passed and instead of arbitrarily increaseing the price by throwing in KI gold which has lost its value since some things you can’t buy with it. On paper it sounds just like the shago fund except better. In fact instead of 100 percent of the funds going to tournaments like the shago one only half is so the rest is going to IG to make more in game content…
I guess maybe people were expecting idk buy this skin and if we get a lot of money we will give everyone stages??
Give us money and we will make in game content??
But isn’t that the deal with any optional content the devs give us? If everyone bought all the terror/gold skins then undoubtedly the money would go to paying the employees as well as making more in game content. There is no need to have a community fund to do that…
I guess the only part of the fund that people liked wasn’t the donating part but the promise by the dev to give them a particular in game content they wanted at the time. It felt like they were actually funding a specific in game content that the community wanted at the time. Either the fans misunderstood the purpose of community funds or the Dev’s misunderstood why the fans actually wanted more community funds.
I wonder why this happened? Was it how IG worded the shago community fund? Did the big streamers who used donations from their viewers(on behalf of the viewers by the way) to buy many multiple copies off the shago fund copies give the wrong impression on what the purpose of the fund was? Was this avoidable?
Would people still dislike this community fund if it was EXACTLY like the shago one? 20 bucks for a fulgore skin that might get a new moveset on its own if enough people buy it and reach a goal plus some KI gold with less value than before?( somehow I don’t think people would like this option)"
I really don’t see that many big name players here though, most of them seem to be average Joes who just really love playing KI. Seems a little weird to cater to a smallest fraction of the community just because they’re louder and more influential. :o
I get what you’re saying, they do have a lot of reach but bending over backwards for a fraction of the population and expecting the rest of us to pick up the bill? I dunno, catering to the minority seems a little messed up. If we the casual masses weren’t here KI wouldn’t be as big as it is, there wouldn’t be 3 seasons of KI to play at EVO, there wouldn’t be community funds to pay for their prize pots. A little more consideration for all the faceless drones who follow the pros and pay the bills would be nice.
I like the pro scene but sometimes I feel like a second class citizen when tournament supporters on the forums here belittle and attack everyone who says they’re not feeling this forced donation thing with Kilgore. Man, we pay the bills, a little understanding would be nice. The “don’t like it, don’t buy it” line is getting old, KI is our game and we want to support it, don’t feed us that crap. 
idk about that one, given then context of 6 million downloads and 20 years of franchise history, I’d be surprised if pro players were the ones responsible for driving those numbers. In certain online spaces, sure, pro players love to post endlessly and ‘market’ the game for free. But the game also gets publicity from good old word of mouth, xbox sharing, just like any other game.
Capcom tried the thing where they cater to pro plaers at the expense of casuals and admitted they got burned- the casuals who may not post endlessly about the game when satisfied sure made it known that launching w such a bare bones product was terrible.
looking forward to the next idea
Well yes. The Shago fund was exactly like this - except for all the ways you listed in which it was different. I think those differences matter. This is well worn territory. It was a bundle with KI gold, the skin (that many of us already had), support for tournaments and the reach goal of adding a new character that wasn’t in the game yet. It was a bundle with tournament support as part of a package and a chance to demonstrate that there was a healthy fan base willing to put more money into the game. It occurred towards the end of Season 2 when the game had about 16 characters not after the end of Season 3 when the game has 26. We have known we will be getting three new characters for a while. We didn’t know anything about a community fund. And frankly the tournament scene has been pretty douchey between the last fund and the current one. I, personally feel a lot less benevolent towards the guys streaming and placing in tournaments than I did a year ago - because a lot of those guys have trashed the game and denigrated people who supported the game.
You can say all those things don’t bother you, and that’s great. But you can’t pretend like this is exactly like the previous community fund except for a few people being delusional. That’s not fair or true.
As far as people asking for a community fund I’m sure the tournament scene asked for it and they are (and should be) wholeheartedly supporting it. I didn’t see any forum regulars asking for a community fund to support tournaments. I saw a lot of people with, frankly, unrealistic ideas about community funds for Ultimates and stages. But hey, we’re getting Ultimates which no doubt is making lots of folks happy.
As far as what they could have done differently - recognizing that it was a rhetorical device on your part intended to suggest they couldn’t have done it differently, all I can tell you is why I feel bad. 1. I’m not thrilled with the pro scene right now because of the actions of a lot of individuals in that scene. 2. Kilgore is more expensive than anticipated - and he isn’t cosmetic content. 3. We didn’t get any info on the other two characters - leaving people agonizing over the price point etc. I for one have “surprise!” fatigue. Maybe I’m the only one. 4. There’s nothing really attached to the fund that makes me interested in its success. I paid my $10 and got Kilgore. I will get literally nothing out of it whether a billion other people or twelve other people buy him. There’s no goals for the fund that matter very much for me, which makes it easier to just focus on the money.
KI has also been kind of chasing the approval of the pro crowd for a while now and I’m sort of tired of that as well. They wanted a PC port and got one, they wanted fewer patches and got that, they wanted specific character changes and got those. And the response has been absolutely toxic Twitch streams and complaining about the game.
So yeah, these all seem like pretty important distinctions between now and a year and a half ago. You’re welcome to your own opinion but I’m hard pressed to see why anyone would be baffled that people feel differently about this one.
I think the goal aspect is the big thing here with Kilgore fund. Despite the Shago fund not actually being to fund Shago, all that money went to tournaments, people at least had a goal that would give them something down the line. With Kilgore there is no goal, it’s straight up just donate to the tournament scene. Honestly, if they were already working on Ultimates why not “pretend” that they were a goal for the kilgore fund? It would have made people much much more willing to spend that extra $5 despite again the money not actually going towards that goal.
Granted that’d probably be shady as heck to pretend ultimates were a goal when they were already being made regardless… kudos IG for not going that route.
I dont know anyone that purchased this game due to a pro player or a known player. We all knew about this game becasue we played it as kids and we never forgot. Now IM sure all the super youngsters may have seen it on a stream or youtube… but they also have less money to spend since us older folks probably have a more stable career ect…
1 way to solve this… the next Character has a community fund as well…but its for game content…PERIOD. Lets see how it goes when he tables are turned.
and for the 3rd character… the funds can go to the forums and forum only online tournaments LOL
Actually, we aren’t certain yet that character number two won’t have a fund to support Ultimates and character number three a fund to support stages, or kidney transplants or who knows what. They showed Jagos Ultimate but haven’t said everyone is getting one. Yeah that’s a stretch but I’m constantly being surprised.
honestly it doesnt matter what i think.the point that i was trying to make is what the people who created the community fund think. it feels like they saw the length people would go to get shago a charecter and thought the next best thing would simply be to give them another character but the situation is more complicated than that. shago is a unique case that i doubt could ever be repeated
by all means go ahead. it wasnt rhetorical i actually want to know because i have a feeling that no other community fund could match the ferver that the shago fund was completed and trying will might only mess up