Well, damn.
Thatâs a really well-thought-out theory!
Personally when it comes to Magic I believe one has to use their inner âchiâ, âkiâ, âlifeforceâ, âenergyâ to actually conjure, alter, transmute, etc.
Kan-Ra uses his own Energy within himself to imbue these incantations that target certain energies that allows him to conjure sand, alter his bandages, and cause torpor to his enemies.
I think Thunder and Tusk are using Holy Magic and they also use incantations but I think their souls and lifeforce play apart in connecting them to the elements that their Gods connected them to. In Thunderâs case his spiritual energy is being used to connect with the Heavens so they may give him Lightening and Shadow. For Tusk he howls Wolf Spirit to the sky and can summon holy fire from the Earth.
Vampire magic is what vampires use to harbor these powers. Their resurrection connects their beings to hellish energy, demonic magics. Since their lifeforce has been connected to these demon energies they gain control over certain abilities like glamor, and mind control, levitation, and conjuring which is everything Mira can do.
In Jagoâs case he is using incantations to focus his Spirtual Energy and use it directly. He probably learned from scrolls just like Kan-Ra learned from books. Magic to me is just the ability to manipulate energies with your Life Force. For Jago he is using incantations and tech that use his lifeforce directly from his body and soul.
Glacius and Cinder is where this idea gets muddy because Glacius uses telekinesis to manipulate the elements , however what is telekinesis vs mental energy? What is mental energy vs spiritual energy? What is spiritual energy vs Life Force? They all basically fall into the same pool of which one would manipulate energies with their own energy. Just my take.
You are conflating terms. Magic by definition isnât natural, it is supernatural. Conjuration, alteration, transmutation, etc. arenât naturally occurring phenomena as they, in most cases, skirt the laws of nature / reality. By comparison, typically âchiâ and âkiâ and all that are naturally occurring phenomena that just exist, and characters naturally tap into and use. Speaking of KI specifically, I think the best way to differentiate between what is magic and what is not magic is by looking at the origin of said power.
For example, Kan-ra DOESNâT use âhis ownâ energy to power his magics, he has his necronomicon (a book filled with spells and incantations) and he has also amassed a ton of âcurses and boonâsâ to sustain himself and defy the laws of nature. In the Rivals mode too, it is said that Kan-ra is at his most powerful after he made his âsiphonâ and took a huge portion of Aganosâ lifeforce among with many others, in fact that is one of the things Kan-ra is most known forâŠtaking the lifeforce of others, essentially sacrificing their lives to empower his own. Kan-ra is essentially the Shang Tsung of KI.
I donât know about Tusk, but Thunder uses the power of his âweyekinâ. Thunderâs power is like how Nightwolf from MK gets his powers, or how Liu Kang or Kim Wu get their powers, by being merged in a way with the spirit of an animal / mythical beast. Depending on how you want to define these things, they could be considered magic, but at the same time they could be seen a naturally occurring phenomena. Animals, especially in Native American culture, are like the definition of nature as these âspiritual beastsâ exist naturally, and when a person comes of age and is gifted with their Weyekin, that is just what happens.
It is hard for me personally to see this a magic in this context as this all deals with souls and other natural energies. These arenât supernatural things per say, but they undoubtedly ride that line very tight.
That is the questionâŠin KI are the vampires (un)dead?
If the vampires are undead, they are undoubtedly supernatural creatures, but if they are âaliveâ and are ânatural creaturesâ in the universe, then what they do can only be defined as some sort of genetic, mutant ability.
Where do you get this from? Why do you think Jago learned âspellsâ from âscrollsâ and what not? What âtechâ do you think he has / uses?
Jago, being Orchidâs brother, is more likely to have something in common with her, and she got her powers from UT tampering with her DNA via her and Jagoâs Grandmother. Jago may use the term âendokukenâ and the like to help him focus his power, but the power itself undoubtedly comes from him, not the incantation.
Telekinesis is a psychic energy, and typically psychics are seen as supernatural. Thing is though, that definition is in regards to OUR reality, not this fictional one (as most of the terms and definitions being used here are). In KIâs reality, Glacius is of an alien race who are naturally born with this ability. To them this isnât magic, it is just how they function.
Youâre only seeing the Forest for the trees with that take on Kan-Ra. If you think Kan-Ra can do all that he does and it doesnât fatigue or tire him in any form then one can say he absolutely doesnât use any of his own Energy to use his spells. Yes he did steal them story wise and he learned from Books and even has items pre-powered that has nothing to do with his actual abilities ala Temperance and Vengeance. But you canât sit here and say He says a word and boom things happen, thatâs just not how I believe a magic spell can work. If one is using Magic then they are most definitely using something within themselves to actually connect and conjure from the sources they learned. If anyone can do it then it would be more Kan-Raâs running around. However because that isnât so this undeniably means something about that individual is special or is using something that few or none are using. What can they be using or what do they possess that grants them the ability to use Magic? I say they are using their own energy in some fashion to harness these mystic arts. As for conflating terms, I mean Magic as I know it is just as much apart of the universe as any sort of action. Stardust turning into Planets, Stars turning into Gravity Wells aka Black Holes. Radiation and Matter combining to form Stars. Air, Pressure and Gravity creating a physical Liquid e.g. Water. Magic is nothing compared to what the overall Universe has done, A magician making a woman disappear vs nothing (singularity) turning to a Multiverse.
As for this I already know much of the cultures and vocab so please understand that I am not Ignorant on that matter. Hence why I called it Holy Magic. Weyekin are holy. Thunder Bellows a huge Prayer to the Heavens and they send him Lightening and Shadow. It may not be Earthly energies but itâs mystical AF lol. Everything about Thunder is Wizard or BattleMage like. Native style of course but subtracting cultural nuances & peculiarities; bottom line Thunder is using Magic from off World, outta this Dimension really. Pardon me my native brothers for saying this but Thunder having a spiritual guide that resembles the Crow isnt too far away from Kan-Ra being connected to Scarabs and other bugs. I can say that Thunderâs animal was granted to him via the Gods, while Kan-Raâs animals are conjured via underworld.
Now thisâŠI mean if youâre a marvel fan I get itâŠbut there is no such thing as a Genetic abilities in reference to harnessing any form of Energies that can manipulate life or death, elements, or space-time; Not Counting Aliens, and Alien Gods like Glacius and Gargos of course. I know in Marvel Universe Mutant Powers like Cyclops are not the same as Mystic Powers like Dr.Strange, and are also different from Cosmic Powers like Galactus and Eternity; Which are also different from Godly powers like Thor and Dormmamu, whom also use their own forms of Magic. So thinking in terms of mutants and genetics when it comes to energy manipulation of any kind is just too messy and Marvel like. In terms of KI I would say itâs closer to real life where if you do something impossibly spectacular with a element or internal energies then itâs straight Magic.
I get this from my imagnation of course, like the very creators of this stuff weâre nerding on right now silly lol.
You may be right about Jago only getting these abilities because his Grandmother was experimented on which in the story it isnât clear if She already had abilities and the Government captured and tested on her because she was special or became special because the she was tested on. However I say Jago used scrolls and âtechâ aka Techniques because heâs apart of a secret society of Warrior Monks that in his story give me no reason to believe he is the Only one capable of the Endokuken, heâs just really â â â â good at it. He did kill another warrior sent to assassinate him for some reason, we donât know much about this warrior but he thought he could challenge Jagoâs Tiger Fury. Thereâs not much on any of the arts and techniques he learned from the Elders of his society but Iâm thinking he didnât magically come up with Shoryuken ( Tiger Fury), Endokuken, and Wind Kick. I think someone taught him, and if they did then that means Jago is using his own Ki, Mana, Spritual Energy, Chakra whatever you want to call it to use these moves. His DNA he inherited from his Grandmother for all we know can just make him Super Proficient at these moves on a level unseen before.
Since the posts are getting a bit⊠lengthy, maybe itâs time to take the conversation to PMs?
It depends. In the story it was said that Kan-ra was too drained to reopen the portal after Maya defeated him. That is an example of his accrued power (the siphon) not being enough to perform a certain action. He probably does get fatigued mentally and physically after using certain spells and the like, but that wouldnât weigh in on whether he is using magic or not. People get tired running, that isnât magical or mystical in any way.
And about Temperance and VengeanceâŠI donât get where you are coming from. The daggers are enchanted items that Kan-ra encountered and stole. He used them for his own means, and it has been shown that they do indeed take a toll on the wielder, but their innate power seemingly has little to nothing to do with the inner power of the person who possesses them.
Kan-ra is cured. He was cursed by the King, he was further cursed by sorcerers he sought out to help in âun-curseâ himself, and then he further cursed himself in the centuries thereafter in order to balance out the âboonsâ he also applied to himself. At this point one could probably argue that Kan-ra isnât human anymore, rather he is a magical being who used to be human.
Anyway, how does Kan-ra âpowerâ his magic? All we know is that Kan-ra takes the lifeforces of the people he defeats (âYou will no longer need this!â) and presumably that is what keeps him going. The siphon he carries seemingly allows him to overload himself with the life essences that he takes, thus allowing him to use stronger spells and do things he would normally not be able to do. So technically yes the power âcomes from himâ but it is stolen power that he has amassed using the skills and knowledge he has gained through the magics, and the pursuit of the magics, he uses.
Kan-ra is special in the way he is driven, and how smart / resourceful he is. Not âeveryoneâ would be able to do the things he has done, and I would say it takes a pretty unique person to pull off all that he has.
All magic is, is an explanation for something that is unexplainable in reality. It is sort of like the âgod of the gapsâ argument. In that regard, transmutation, turning some thing in to something else, can be construed as magic, most specifically so if it doesnât happen in nature. Turning a wooden staff in to a living snake is magic. The universe doesnât do that on it own. In terms of KI, bringing a Golem to life is magic, or being able to live for 3000 years is magic. Things like conjuring âfirecatsâ isnât magic, as that specifically has been defined as having to do with genetic mutation / modification.
Where did you read that? I canât say that I am any where near an expert on the subject, but from the sources Iâve read, a weyekin ISNâT divine, but rather a mediator between our word and the divine.
I donât know what is going on with Thunder as he channels lightning. It probably has a lot to do with his weyekin spirit, but again, this has nothing to do with âthe godsâ per say. Sure is it mystical AF, borderline magic, if not magic outright, but we just donât know which I why I error on the side of caution.
We donât know why Kan-ra uses scarabs (probably a mummy reference), and âthe underworldâ in KI lore has only been alluded to as the âAstral Planeâ where the Shadow Lords and there minions have dominion. We know Kan-ra aspires to go there / have dominion there, but so far he has not had and direct connection to that place.
(Arguably you could say that all beings are connected to the astral plane through their spirits, but Iâm not going to go there.)
I agree it is messy, but everything isâŠeven in KIâs lore. But to compare Marvel and KI for a minute: Thunder and Storm.
Storm controls nature, similar to how Thunder with his weyekin presumably do. All the weyekin does is CONNECT Thunder with nature / the natural energies of Earth, which would be the perfect explanation for why he is able to call and channel lightning like he does.
You may be right about the grand-mother already having the powers before she volunteered for the program. That being said, just because Jago was trained by those monk doesnât mean they could do the same things he could.
Orchidâs backstory alludes to Jago being left at the monastery for a particular reason. It probably has something to do with the same reason why Jacob wanted to protect Orchid and hide her powers away. So far in the KI lore there is no reason to believe that a multitude of people exist in the world who can do these special things like that. It seems as if in KI you are either born with powers, or you gain them through extraordinary means.
It would make much more sense to me that Jago had been born with an innate power which was interpreted as âthe Tiger Spiritâ and was why he was given over to the monks in the first place. They trained him, and protected him, and taught him to control his powerâŠuntil he killed a guy and exiled himself.
Sorry if we are derailing the topic. Just trying to hash out the deets and put some of the more abstract concepts of KI in perspective.
It took me way too long to get around to reading this, but Iâm really glad I finally did! I love going for the novella approach. What an awesome evolution from character profiles, which themselves seemed to get better and better with each character.
Iâm always a sucker for little details; small random facts or terms that an author uses that convey both a depth of knowledge on the subject, but also an authenticity within the world itself. There were some nice touches throughout.
I also loved some of the imagery, especially with regards to her claws. I hope thereâs more along those lines and I hope that it sticks to using more of a sensory approach, with less explaining. I dig that approach and I thought this chapter was strongest in its description when it went this route, or when the description was less common or overly familiar.
I also enjoyed how the author painted Mira as a character. We got details about her past, her conflicting experience with gauntlets, that taste of her own blood⊠Again, small details within the narrative itself that add up to a clear picture that places me there in my mind. Thatâs the kind of stuff I really dig.
Awesome job so far! Canât wait to see whatâs next. Man⊠A KI novella. Whoâd have thought? Seriously, you guys are great. I really appreciate it this, but I also really enjoy it as well. 
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Personally I like my ideas and others to be public and start a discussion. But if my post are bothering you Iâll back out of the thread. Maybe make my own someday about KI lore. Not to be snarky but I didnât know discussing KI lore was that off topic for this particular thread.
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I suggested moving the conversation simply because there are very lengthy posts which are discussing the general lore and mechanics of the KI universe, and itâs no longer really about the novella.
I donât dislike the conversation you guys are having, or feel youâre doing anything wrong or disrespectful! I just feel like it warrants itâs own thread/PM chain.
I agree with @DraconianMith in that I would rather the conversation be public. I too would love it if others would give their perspective on the KI universe and add to the discussion.
But yeah, the posts are getting pretty long.
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I suggested PMs at first because it was mainly a conversation between two/three people, but if you wanted to make a specific KI magic and lore thread, it would likely draw attention and input from the community. All of my comments here were intended as a simple suggestion.
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@UncappedWheel82 posts were long lol! !! However they were interesting none the less.
Whenâs the 2nd chapter?
EDIT: lol itâs up since 14 minutes ago! http://www.ultra-combo.com/ki-novella-chapter-2-watchman-awakes/
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I liked this chapter about Tusk more so than the Mira one.
Tusk is so clearly a viking lmao, i loved this chapter way more than Miraâs, also, the gods that created him were from the same race as Gargos? thats intense
âJago was abandoned as a baby at a secluded monastery in the Himalayas, where he was trained by Tiger Monksâ sounds more structurally correct and less try-hard, but, hey, thatâs just me.
I donât have the time nor energy to argue. All Iâm going to say is that the novella is more professionally-written than just about anything before it. Take that as you will.
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UhhâŠwhat happened to the book format? I kind of donât want to read it in html.
ââŠa young Asian woman wielding chain sticks and guarded by a celestial being in the guise of a dragon. Tusk saw the evil blue-skinned warrior with the skull mask looming behind her and he knew, in that moment, that the young womanâs fate would be tied to his, for good or ill.â
Well, @CrazyLCD, looks like Kim Wuâs not a demon â â â -kicker after all. XD
EDIT: Maybe I misinterpreted this quote. Is she being held captive or is Shadow Jago sneaking up on her in her temple?
This story was awesome, though. I liked the idea of Shadow Jago attacking Tusk while heâs drinking. Heâs just as much of a jerk as he is in game.