They can live, Gargos cannot. He’ll destroy the world [spoiler]#ShadowLordsReferenceSortOf[/spoiler]
Really? Fulgore, Spinal, Sadira, Glacius and Thunder can walk all over Gargos if played right. I thought Gargos was good too, then I played him and he relies heavily on making chaos happen on screen. If he doesn’t get there, he isn’t going to do much. I would challenge you, if Gargos is so Op, go on ranked and win 100% of your matches and earn a pro medal. Should be cake for a character as OP as Gargos is right?
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Being a Gargos main, I would chime in, but it seems the more technical members have already said more than I could.
I will say this: Gargos’s zoning is reliant heavily on predictions. Light portal punches can be avoided by just not standing still, L & M portal punch can be easily jumped over, Heavy doesn’t work well if you dash forward, so really you have an average of a 1 in 3 chance of guessing right provided the opponent keeps mixing up his approaches. In fact, a good deal of his moves seem to revolve around a 1 in 3 prediction. So really you should only be getting stuffed by his zoning if you’re telegraphing your approach.
It’s funny, I don’t have any trouble with Gargos. But I do have trouble with better players than me… Maybe the OP should think more along those lines. Jago is not in a particularly bad spot in this matchup just because he can’t full screen, projectile invincible anytime Gargos tries a portal punch. And setting up contorted realities like “if i’m in danger and at full screen and he has two minions out, how am I supposed to win?” You aren’t supposed to win if you allow Gargos to get two minions out, knock you into the danger zone and position you at full screen. I would expect you to lose. If you want to win you have to prevent this from happening.
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Gargos’s minions belong in a 2d side-scroller beat’em up as a boss character fight. Absolutely the most ridiculous gimmick I’ve ever seen in a competitive fighting game. Introduce way too many random elements, and break the flow of the game. They are an unwise gameplay decision, in my opinion.
A much more sound decision would have had the minions come out as part of his instinct whereby he can enhance some of his combos or attacks with them. But they shouldn’t just be walking around on the stage. They should be part of an explicit move or moves. MKX’s chatacter, can’t recall the name, has a waaay better implementation of a tag team opponent.
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Minions are not random, they attack after every 3 seconds, not after nor later. Gargos decides where they stand, they dont decide when attack or where to go.
Also you should pay atention to what BigBadAndy said, if you allow Gargos to summon 2 minions at full screen you are suposed to loose, you cant let that happen and even if this happens there are ways to still beat Gargos, especially with Jago who has a good MU agains the Shadow Lord.
You should go to rank in the killer tier and use Gargos to see how “OP” he really is, especially now that he got nerfed.
Fara/Torr? That’s not really comparable.
As far as Gargos’s minions, you are free to like or not like whatever you want. But the idea that these make the game somehow unplayable or no longer strategic just isn’t true. It’s like Aganos’s armor. You have to play to beat it, specifically - you can’t just keep doing what you would do against the rest of the cast. And yeah, good players take advantage of minions to protect them while they do otherwise risky and dirty stuff. Sort of like throwing a fireball with Ryu and then doing an anti-air DP when your opponent jumps over it. I mean, that’s what fighting games are about.
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Maybe they attack every 3 secs…Maybe not. What if they are knocked down? What if they are out of range to attack either horizontally or the opponent is airborn? There are a number of variables that certainly add to the randomness of the matchup. In fact, unless I’m misunderstanding something, isn’t it possible to knock down minions unintentionally and just by chance if your move happens to clip them? That’s pretty random.Sorry, I see what you’re saying. Maybe I wasn’t clear enough.
*Attacking every 3 secs is not really user controlled. The user can get lucky that their opponent is poked out of a combo, without even inputting any commands. This is bad form, in my opinion.
Well, that’s randomness on your part though, not the minions. That’s like saying you threw out a random windkick and your opponent might randomly not be blocking.
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The only variable that they have is that they can attack you while you are standing in the floor or while you are airbone but the time never changes and its because you cant just jump over minions while they attack you.
isn’t it possible to knock down minions unintentionally and just by chance if your move happens to clip them? Your moves can clip unintentionally Gargos or any other charachter that you might be fighting in any fighting game.
My point is only one, the minions are not as random as you believe. I know this because im a Gargos main and those minions are my salvation but they never act different, they always attack after x seconds, if they are out of range of my enemie they ll walk towrds to him always at the same speed and they ll atack my enemy always at the same range.
Of course there is a random factor, the best example is the one that you give, (a minion pokes you while you are hitting me or just attacking me) but there are ways to avoid this. Tyr to jab the minion first and then attack the Gargos, the minion wont get up until you finish your combo.
LMAO holy shiiiit. @SonicDolphin117 the armchair player, that’s the first I’ve heard that one.
Seriously though, just walk and block. Everything gargos does without minions out will just back him to the corner. With minions out, just chill til you have a chance to do something random and take the match back.
Gargos has a serious defense problem. He’s great at zoning from fullscreen but in the midscreen game he struggles to stop approaches. Just walk until you’re in a range where he starts to sweat; at that point he has to do something unsafe to get you into a range he likes to play. Once you get close to him just run a train on him. Jago has great offense, you should be able to open him up easily.
I do get an odd feeling from this post, though…
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Not even remotely close. A wind kick is an intentional input put forth by my opponent. Minions walking around and poking and being in different places is not something that is really a controlled action.
In the end I guess it doesn’t really matter. I’m not playing in any tournaments and there’s no real money to be made in them anyway. So I’ll just avoid Gargos online.
I don’t think the 3-second rule is necessarily true, because if it was, you’d be seeing the minions throwing out their attacks at nothing when nowhere near the opponent, which just isn’t the case.
That said, both minions do have a rhythm and timing to their attacks and are not random by any sense of the word. They will always attack within about sweep range, when you get juggled, jump in, or in between Gargos’ attacks. When both minions are in play, that rhythm and timing remains, but it’s a bit off-set depending on the minion’s positioning in relation to you, so you might get a quick 1-2 combo attack from them both, for example, rather than just 1 poke or overhead.
The thing that’s great is that it doesn’t take much to get rid of them - they can only take 2 or 3 hits, depending on the minion, and damage doesn’t matter, so to prevent from being opened up, your fastest attacks usually work best. Take your time though, and wait for Gargos to back off or make a mistake 1st before taking the advantage against him or his minions. Furthermore, blocking a minion is easy, even if they’re behind you - simply block away from Gargos, just like normal. Even though he ultimately lost the fight, some of the best vs. Gargos defense I’ve seen was Bass’ Spinal against Sleep at CEO 2016 finals - check it out; you’ll get a pretty good idea of how it all works (although you’ll have to keep in mind that this was before the devs changed the knockdown rules for minions).
Being honest, I don’t even know what that means lmao
The minions attack every three seconds when you are in range. They won’t attack if you are too far away and will instead attack as soon as you are close enough to trigger them. The point is less about the three seconds and more about the fact that the minions are not random. You can keep track of them and predict what they will do.
It means the OP is salty af and isn’t a regular reader of the forums, so he has no idea who he’s talking to.
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No, I’m serious. lol
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I think it’s a reference to armchair quarterback, meaning someone who sits in their couch and explains how a pro football player should have won the game last night. The implication is that you don’t really play the game enough to know what you’re doing. Hence the irony.
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Yeah that’s what I assumed, just wanted to ask anyway.
And yes, the irony is hilarious.
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So, basically all you’re saying is that they attack every 3 seconds when in range? I still don’t believe it (I honestly believe they attack slightly faster than that), but I’ll time it for myself to find out for sure.
You were gonna say Sadira weren’t you? 