Why I don't Want Any More Seasons

General Discussion
82

I don’t pick put animations in general. I don’t look at ki frame by frame.

But as an artist it would be nice to see something with a bit more composition.

It’s about making the motions look epic. I think sf5 does a better job of that most of the time than Killer instinct.

I mean if you compare Kim Wu to Chun li? Kim looks very 2d in mer motions where chun is all over the place. Kim looks stiffer and less fluid.

Ki is a faster game so it’s never going to look the same but just a little more exaggeration would be awesome. I think if you look at orchid from season one she has some of that magic to her.

It’s animated rather than real… I think we need a bit of both.

What do you think @Dayv0

http://abload.de/img/chunhgse6.gif

2 Likes
83

ALSO @CrazyLCD great timing:

https://twitter.com/eurogamer/status/791943912680062976

Capcom updated its sales figures for its video games overnight and it doesn’t look good for Street Fighter 5.

In fact, it looks pretty terrible for Street Fighter 5.

Capcom said it’s shipped 1.4m copies of Street Fighter 5 since it came out in February 2016. That’s the exact same number it posted back in May.

This means fewer than 100,000 copies were shipped from May to 30th September.

Funny sounds like no community is happy?

EVO, Streams, All that dont mean S*it when it comes to GOOD hard sales. This was the biggest game at Evo yet they cant sell the game?

Pros, tounerment players and Streams get way too much podium time in the FGC. Killer instinct does it better when it stops litening and following.

personally i feel SF5 suffers from the same thing KI season 3 does? a lack of interesting characters. The new guys are ok (if a bit dull) and the staples are good but oddly mixed imo. Bits of 3rd strike bits of alpha bits of super to me it all feels a bit like an all stars game.

Lets just do what we do best! Gameplay, net code, online play, individual characters, stages, hype ,acsessablity and music!

i think the days have gone when we should WANT killer instinct to be as success ad SF because inevitably it is “off scene”

3 Likes
84

I don’t agree with this. IMO S3 has very interesting characters both visually and gameplay wise. The problems which most people have with S3 characters are:
-Guests. IMO, 3 guests out of 26 characters is ok, but all the 3 guests in the same season may not be the best delivery. Other people just hates/dislikes guests.
-“Gimmicks”. Some people doesn’t like gimmicky characters, like Gargos. Funny, because S2 has more gimmicky characters than S3 IMO.

The important point here is that this is all opinions. IMO, S3 has 50% of my favorite characters(Fulgore, Kan-Ra, Aganos, Aria, Hisako, Tusk, Kim Wu, Raam, Gargos, Eyedol). For me, S3 it’s a GREAT selection of characters. The only reason I prefer S2 over S3(in terms of characters) is because I prefer new/returning characters over guests. But I LOVE S3. It’s like choosing between, I don’t know, a chocolate cake and a chocolate milshake. I like both, but normally I prefer the milkshake. Other people speaks about different seasons like choosing between chocolate and ■■■■. Way to hyperbole for me

S3 is good, really really good, IMO, in terms of characters. That’s not the problem, and it’s not SFV’s problem either.

SFV has good characters too. The game has other problems IMO:
-Inconsistent netcode. I don’t know how it goes currently(since I only played SF V offline), but at launch, it was terrible. And that lasted enough to root into costumers mind. I worked 8 years for Gamestop. During that time, I saw games that had terrible release due bugs and many people sold the game back in no time. And that people spread the word about the game, even when it was fixed, and never came back after some patchs. It’s really hard for some games to survive a bad release, even if they fix their problems later.
-Release was totally focused into the competitive scene. Almost no other options than fight against other player. Almost no options against AI. Hard to unlock extra colors. Many non-die hard loyalist saw this as an issue that they didn’t want to deal. The game wasn’t friendly to people who just wanted to play against the AI.
-Polemic stuff, like the “spyware” they put in one PC update. Nuff said here.
-Capcom is not the most communicative company around, so although many people would complain about lack of info in KI, we got each character in the month they promised. Capcom not only didn’t delivered all of them in time, it also gave some information very late

There is more stuff to be considered, gameplay wise for example, but I want to highlight this particular ones because I fell that this are the major difficulties for SFV. IMO these are the reasons of their lower than expected sales.

About the animations… I don’t know man, although I concede that SF has great animations, I don’t feel KI as badly animated. Could use fix in some particular stuff, but nothing that needs a “total rework”.

85

I am sooo glad I missed that one. When I had heard about it, I hadn’t been on Steam at all for a few days, and I intentionally stayed off of it until that issue was resolved. That was crap, and honestly I hadn’t seen that bad of a screwup (on the technical end) since the Maximo demo on PS2 that had a bug that would wipe your memory card.

1 Like
86

This was not someone screwing up something and broking the game. This was spyware, put in our PCs in a subtle and malicious way.

That’s unforgivable, and one of the most dirtiest moves which a game developer has ever made

1 Like
87

Well, yeah I know one was intentional and the other wasn’t. I was referring to both incidents having a negative impact on gamers & becoming a PR nightmare for them, not that they were equal scenarios. Sorry if I didn’t make that distinction clear.

1 Like
88

hmmm. interesting points. I have a theory and it’s not really related to what u posted above, so apologies in advance.

put simply. could it be that new players realize that entry into a 3 year old game is very demanding per individual. most people like to watch. if we compare say network television to twitch viewers then it’s not a far stretch to say the season 5 of the walking dead had more viewership than the premier of season 7 and indeed that is true.

89

There’s a lot of wisdom in here, even if I may not agree with you on all the details. I keep thinking about posting a new thread to try and have a mature discussion about the contribution of the FGC to a games success (or lack of contribution) but I can’t imagine it going anywhere good.

So, just to get it out of the way - I am not particularly enamored by SF5. It’s fun for me to play with my brother, but I’m just nowhere like as interested as I am in KI. But I really, really want SF5 to succeed - because I like fighting games and when the popular culture flagship for the genre goes down in flames it is bad for everyone.

So, there is absolutely no question that SF5 is the dominant force in the FGC right now. The biggest tournament numbers, the most streamers the most stream viewers. All that stuff that LCD is using as a proxy for KI’s lack of success. But if there’s any truth to this EuroGamer article @WandaMaximoff cites, then all of that tournament success has translated into absolutely NOTHING in regard to sales success. Capcom is not making money from tournaments as far as I know. So how does this affect people’s view of how important “the scene” is for a fighting game? Meanwhile, MKX is hanging around, still running pro-league events and generally being ■■■■ on by the FGC crowd as a terrible game, but NRS and WB are sitting on such a ■■■■-ton of cash that they can gift us all with new netcode post launch and busily reinvest in Injustice 2 and probably already another MK sequel on the drawing board.

We don’t have good data. So KI may be failing spectacularly at both sales and the FGC. But even if you believe one I think it’s really tenuous to link the two together. People like @CrazyLCD are upset that the game is not doing the things they want - driving stream traffic and a robust tournament scene. And there is nothing wrong with voicing that opinion or wanting those things - I don’t want to seem critical about that. But I do think it’s willful denial to think that those things help give a game monetary success. I think they can contribute (SF5 would be dead and buried without the FGC for sure), but I don’t think they can make a game successful. And I don’t think a game needs these things to be successful.

9 Likes
90

You may not agree with him (and I sure don’t), but you certainly can’t doubt @CrazyLCD’s ability to get a conversation going.

3 Likes
91

Oh dear Larry, you don’t know how much I feel yaXD I’m with you on everything you said.

92

Great example. But I still think most of the S1 character have extremely good animations. Jago, Wulf, Glacius (without that silly saaaaajam backdash… he could have just floated back a bit..), Fulgore and Orchid have super solid, consistent animations. The only post S1 characters that reached that level of fluidity are Hisako, Aria, Rash (to a certain extent), Mira (almost) and Gargos (The chubby minion included:P).

What I would love to see in a sequel is animation concistency… Never release a character with clunky animations… they are more important than the visuals.

2 Likes
93

how would they smooth animations out? I know a quick fix is just to add more frames or an approximation of the last frame and next frame. didn’t the devs say that anything more than I described above needs a total rework that vista significantly more resources?

94

I think they should work on that instead of using the resources to just add more stuff. Perhaps in S4. They don’t need to relight all the stages or make a new story mode. Shadow Lords is already built. They can just add more. I would be happy if we just get more stages though.

95

Yeah I agree actually. S1 animations felt more special. They suited their characters more on the whole.

I just think we need to exaggerate them a little make them wowing

1 Like
96

Animation for 3D models isn’t like hand drawn animation. There are different frames for all 60 fps and the character moves between one position and the next. To make the animation “better” you would have to have smoother movement by taking more time to move a certain distance. But you can also add visual details and extraneous motion. So it’s not so much about filling in the frames (the frames are always filled) as it is about how you want the character to move. This is why heavies almost always look better than lights - just more time to complete the full range of motion. But modeling the movements so they both look good and move from point a to point b can be time consuming.

It’s also one reason why people often just don’t agree on what animation looks good. I think Kan Ra has some of the best animations in the game and Hisako has some of the worst. @Akudesyn would seem to disagree (which is fine). The consensus is that Maya and TJ are awful, but I don’t see it. I really think the criticisms of post S1 animations are not well founded. One mind trick that influences people is that S1 didn’t have nearly so much hit stop. Hit stop is very effective at making the hits seem powerful, but it interrupts the smooth flow of the animation.

Anyway, if they wanted to re-work animations it would involve simply slowing down the same motions - which could make them seem better animated but is hard to do while keeping the same frame data for the move, or they would need to go back and actually re-work the model to add some extraneous movement details to make it seem smoother. This is all a lot of words to say it isn’t missing frames that are a problem.

1 Like
97

One more thing.

This is what the first step of rectifying the problem looks like. Getting attention off of the people that make the game and the community look bad. What comes next is creating more content that helps people learn and get involved in the game to fill the void left after getting eyes off of content that could at best be described as nonconstructive criticism. I’m trying to do that with my spreadsheets so people can have quick references for stuff like damage numbers, bass is uploading multiple sets per day which are great to watch to get an idea of things to add to your gameplan, infil only has one* page left for the guide which is still the best learning resource for any fighting game, and ziarist is working on accurate frame data available outside the game.

This is not hiding from a problem.

10 Likes
98

Hello, may I double like this?

2 Likes
99

A sequel means we must wait for re-announcement of jago, orchid, glacius, thunder, spinal,…, something new. You know it, right? Dejà vue? Imagine how much I will be excited when for sfVI they will announce ryu, chun li and ken, for example. My reaction:

"Oh, really!!! Ryu and Ken in a sf game… can’t believe it !! O_O "

Figthing games are probably the most suitable in adapting to dlc logic, since they are and can be expandables containers for every kind of content, without remake everything from the beginning. This is in line with the fact that a fighing game can go on for decades in tournaments and play sessions. Not for nothing we still have sfIII tournaments by today, for example, or players who still play sfII and mkII, as another example.

You should find something deeper than the graphic for change the entire engine and remake every char. Have you planned a new combos patterns, or similar? For change the graphic and fix retros we need a simple remastered.

100

Realistically we wont see a sequel to ki before 2-3 years on the scorpio, i find it funny when people talk like ki is an ugly game lol. i own sf5 and i think ki looks better or atleast they are in the same ball park with mkx being the best. i think people lack perspective , lets not forget that kof just came out and it looks light years behind ki does right now. all ki needs are new wonderful costumes , voice packs , and may be a few character dlc and the occasional balance changes for the game to continue to thrive

1 Like
101

I wish it were that simple, but it isn’t.