Tj combo needs buffs defensively!

Because his dashes work better than Jago’s in many cases. So how can something be bad compared to the generic and balanced character?

I AM NOT SURE IF I AGREE WITH TJ DASHES BEING BETTER THAN JAGOS BUT jago mobility is pretty bad the fact that tj forward dash or back dash is better isnt saying much. jago forward dash has to be slow because he can follow his light fireball to advance towards his opponent, if his mobility was any better it would be OP

I don’t think his dashes are better than Jago’s.

Isn’t saying much? It say’s everything that you choose to debate about… The most generic and balanced character otherwise known as the bases of all other characters. If TJ has a faster forward dash speed and a relatively better back dash then what makes it bad? Not to mention he can use Powerline to cover ground or rely on instinct to move quicker. Just saying, it isn’t bad.

ok i just checked it , tj back dash and forward dash are not better than jagos. sorry you are wrong . and pls dont bring up instinct everybody is cheap in instinct. tj instinct isnt that great compared great compared to others .its just average over all.

You wanna spar sometime?


Lol I’ll stop here. I stand by my point. Checking your very “credible” sources don’t make your argument more sound. Average instinct, good one lol

Put in the work, TJ is still great. His weaknesses are clear in his defense but that is the case with any character. That is all.

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Ooooh. I need to watch these sets. One day Vet, can you teach me some TJ Stuff too? Your TJ is scary. Lol mine looks like a 3 year old mashing the buttons compared to the setups you do. XD

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Lol. My TJ is inconsistent though. Look like a master one round, and an amateur the next. Working on it. But, that’s the difference between high level and mid-level. Consistency. Right now, I’m only mid-level.

You call TJ bottom of the tier list. You also say we won’t see him in competitive play. I am reading what you are saying and you are saying he’s bad and unviable, you rag on his mobility, defenses and instinct (only one of which is a valid point) and then option select the “no no, he’s still good” cop out and backdash on the things you’ve been claiming… ironically it isn’t working because TJ’s back dash is soooooooo dreadful. :sunglasses:

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tj has disadvantages and i am ok with that, him having a low mobility is fine. my only complaint is how tough tj has it defensively right now. in competitive play u want a stable character and tj is as unstable a character as they come in ki at high level play. just so i am clear i am ok with all the disadvantages tj has but he deserves better defensive tools for the type of character he is

Isn’t it a good thing that TJ has to guess what to do on wake up? He has 20% more health than everyone else and his damage is above average. Plus when he’s on offense he’s always forcing the opponent to guess.

20% more health??? i assume you are talking abt instinct. when you look at the incredibly strong instincts in ki. tj’s isnt that speacial. dont get me wrong i am not saying its bad but compare it to jago istinct. all the characters in ki force u to guess on offense. tj is no different. but tj is highly punishable on everything he does

TJ’s forward dash ranks 12th in the cast (out of those with true dashes, as opposed to runs), with his instinct dash being the second fastest in the game next to Aria bass body. His backdash at 25 frames (one frame slower than Jago’s) ranks on the lower middle end of the spectrum (15th) normally, and in instinct becomes tied for the fastest (h/t to @Infilament for the frame data). Both of these out of a cast of 24 - TJ is not uniquely disadvantaged in his movement options, and in instinct becomes best in class.

She does not and it can not. I play Sadira. Shadow recluse is not zero frames and cannot be used as a reversal of any kind, assuming the opponent knows how to properly meaty.

You mean the invincible escape move that bounces you off the nearest wall and spits you right back into your opponent with no invincibility whatsoever? I was not being hypothetical when I talked about an opponent whiffing a fierce meaty on Sadira’s wakeup and then air-to-airing her with a jumping button. That is a legitimate thing, as is whiffed meaty into DP, which is completely impossible for Sadira to evade at certain spacings. Shadow web cling is useless in the corner, full stop. Are you really going to argue that you’d rather have a metered “escape” tool that doesn’t work at all in the corner over fully invincible shadow vortex? Really? That’s the hill you want to die on?

I have a theory on that. It largely revolves around the fact that TJ players hate to block on wakeup. I spent all of S2 OS’ing the hell out of TJ because no matter how many times I shut him down, 97.63% of TJ players refused to just sit still and block. They were forever trying to roll out of pressure, or tremor over an imagined low or throw attempt. That’s what I meant when I referred to “spamming” tremor on wakeup - TJ players were forever trying to do something once they got knocked down. Roll, tremor, shadow vortex, backdash. Just. Freaking. Block. Wake up like a normal human being, and stop trying to push buttons all the time.

Random hobbyhorse of mine, but it is not. Hisako’s grab range is shorter :-p


What? I wouldn’t consider TJ low mobility at all. Low walk speed maybe, but between Tremor covering lots of ground, a strike invincible roll, decent dashes by the frame data (and second fastest in instinct), and the armored dash and strikes for some forward momentum pressure, “low mobility” doesn’t describe TJ in my book.

I’m willing to bet Mira would disagree…GREATLY. Things either go exceptionally well for her, or HORRIBLY awry. For all her super strength, the tradeoff on her health and the constant gambles she has to take to get offense probably puts her as what is probably the most unstable of all current characters.

Then you’ll have to accept TJ as he is, because if TJ had superior defensive options in addition to his supremely awesome offense, he would probably border on the mindlessly good side IG has been trying to avoid with a majority of their characters, or like what he was at the beginning of season 2. Keits has stated before in more than instance, usually during reveal streams, “characters weaknesses aren’t oversights in a character’s design they forgot to cover, they are an intentional counterbalance to the character’s offensive abilities. Should a character be struggling, rather than fixing weaknesses in a design, a character’s strengths should be improved upon so they play more as their intended archetype.”

Basically, TJ’s meant to be imposing in his offense, more so than most others, and keep them under pressure. Should he lose that momentum of his offense, he shouldn’t be allowed to just regain it very easily, he should have to purposely work for it. If he could just get knocked down and get right back up and take the reigns again, what would be the point of trying to put TJ down at all? His lack of defensive measure is the price he pays for his pressure game and tool set. He’s not the worst off in the cast though, in any field of measurable value. He just requires more thought than he used to need to win. I remember season 2 launch TJ, and THAT was a mindlessly powerful character.


when i talk abt mobility i am talking abt tj walk speed and dash speed., and like i said i have no problem with his mobility. it seams u missed the change to tj role. IT HAS LOST ALL OF ITS INVINCIBILITY!! thats why his defense is much worse this season. perhaps if u had this info your post would be different. i understand tj character design and i understand why the invincibility of tj role was removed i just feel he wasnt compensated adequately defensivly for the nerf to the role. mira is blessed with some amazing tools and damage and she can regain the life she looses. mira within the community is considered better than tj overall for a reason

Moved to feedback and suggestions.



Did you guys know you can buffer the roll (Yes, S3 as well)

And dodge all of Cinder’s Shadow Inferno? It’s pretty awesome.

Just my two cents,

If you were basing your ENTIRE game plan around TJ’s Roll, you might have been playing him wrong. Sure, it hurts, but one move changed CANNOT kill a character.