Sabrewulf Season 3 Rebalance Thread

I have to wait until they post the tournament on Youtube. :cry: I can’t watch twitch I missed the finals yesterday because twitch kept crapping out. I got lucky on Saturday when I was able to watch in the morning a bit.

I need to get familiar with the terms of the FGC. What is “instinct cancel?” What’s “whiff?”

My view of feral cancels were that they were for doing manuals or juggling. I wasn’t too far off :wink: watching the pros.

Hm. Fantastic backdashes aren’t really that common in general, and I think super rushdown/mixup characters usually aren’t the ones who get them. Rushdown characters usually have a good forward dash that lets them close (and Wulf’s dash-through is an unreactable left/right mixup), but they’re not normally allowed to get out for free. Riptor is a bit different, but Riptor is also extremely punishable on any mix-up that goes wrong, and her large hurtbox makes her more susceptible to pressure in general. Shago’s backdash also isn’t nearly as safe as it looks - you can stuff it before he actually disappears if your meaty timing is solid.

Wulf’s backdash animation is certainly “interesting” :-p Make no mistake though, Hisako’s backdash is far worse. Backdash utility comes from both distance and recovery (speed). Wulf’s S2 backdash is fairly shallow (has little distance), but it’s recovery is pretty average. HIsako’s backdash goes a touch farther, but has a ton of recovery. S2 Wulf’s backdash certainly isn’t great, but it does have some situational utility.

The original S1 Wulf dash can be seen here:

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whiff means you missed the attack or it was blocked.

instinct cancel is when you pop instinct…freeze frames the game and you change your attack accordingly to your advantage

you do hamstring and its blocked…now feral cancel and do a move out of it to your advantage.

A lot of the replays are already on you tube i thought?

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You know how, if you do Wulf’s jumping slash move (the medium option off of his run) and your opponent blocks it, they’re able to punish you? If you feral cancel, then not only don’t you get punished, you can attack before they recover from blocking.

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Hm, now I’m wondering whether it might be a decent idea to give Wulf back his S1 backdash, being no longer a super mixup character anymore.

Yes…do this…perfect example…but you can just go ape ■■■■ with in while in close and they wont know whatt hit em lol

Oh okay so that’s what the commentators are referring to. Thanks!

I checked yesterday for some videos for Saturday but didn’t see anything yet sadly. I’ll probably have to wait until next weekend or so before someone posts it. Its fine though :slightly_smiling:

That makes sense and that happens to me quite a bit…loI. just started practicing jumping slash a few months ago to get some variety. After seeing the extra frames added in S3 I’ll change that though.

Bad example actually: since you can only feral cancel when grounded you need to land first meaning you are at a minimum of -5 a so are jab/throw punishable. Hamstring would fit the bill however.

Yeah I’ve seen his original backdash. I like to watch old S1 vids on youtube. I don’t even dash I just walk. As much as I wished they kept the backdash in S2 I was pretty satisfied overall with S2 Wulf. S3 Wulf from seeing the video and even some pre season 3 gameplay just looked so odd. Especially him in instinct mode beefy arms and shoulders visually but nothing to make of up for it. IDK I’ll try him. I am curious as to what the pros will do with him now.

I’m dying picturing what a ‘juggle’ after a ‘fecal cancel’ would look like. @TheKeits can we get this one streamed live during the next event? :joy:

Well, having just labbed it up, it seems like everything I thought I knew was a lie. Guess I’ll see if I can consistently get a punish on this in-game later on.

Probably the best example is making eclipse safe, then.

Thinking on it, I’d be fine with a reduced damage buff in instinct (down to 5% from 10%) rather than completely removing it. Watching the KI WC some of the pro Wulf players did stuff that even someone as biased towards Wulf as I am (though I haven’t used him online since S1 apart from a few friendly matches) thought it was pretty dirty.
Keeping a miniscule damage buff would still keep him below pre-Nerf damage potential while giving his instinct a little bit more utility for lower level players to have fun with. It keeps him less scary but also gives him a little more.

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I’m inclined to agree with @STORM179. Sabre’s instinct was a bit too good. The thing to take to heart is that it’s not one particular part of his instinct that made it overwhelming, but the sum of it’s parts. Wulf’s instinct in S1, was purely an augmentative instinct which led to it being too passive so it got buffed in S2, which I’m ok with. It just got buffed to much. Now he has boosted damage, chip damage on normals, and feral cancels (S2). Wulf can be compared to the likes of MVC2 Sentinel and UMVC3 F. West at lv 4 in that even if you successfully block his insane offense, you’re still slowly dying due to chip. Knowing when you can punish is also tough because you have no idea if he can F. Cancel, and when he does open you up, and he will, he’s not only exceedingly difficult to break, due to F. Cancel manuals, but if you get locked out he’ll obliterate your vitality guage. I’m not saying I think he should’ve gotten nerfed, but I understand why they did it.

So IG toned down the feral cancels right? I think a small 5% damage buff without chip damage would be good. But I’m not an expert on balance.

I think it’s just that they gave him too much, especially with him being one of the damaging characters in the game, even outside instinct. Also with him being very fast as well. I’m no expert either man :smiley:

I was definitely happy to see dash-eclipse adjusted somewhat, because that was a major problem for me in some of my vs Sabre matches. It was just too fast to be reacted to.

If you give Wulf better mobility (faster run, a dive kick), you really have to make sure he does less damage overall. Especially in instinct, where he can do manuals of any strength after any random attack if he spends his feral cancel. And now, as Tony said, he can hit people jumping away and convert into a mixup (flipout) or cashout (shadow eclipse) so much more easily, because ragged edge bounces.

I dunno, I think Wulf will still be among the stronger characters in the cast in S3. He definitely won’t feel lacking, especially since (IMO) his hard matchups probably got a little easier and I don’t think his good matchups got worse, really. He’ll just need to open you up once or twice more per round now, which is fair because blocking Wulf is extremely difficult (even with slower jumping slash). Jumping slash is now the same speed as Jago’s overhead (which hits people regularly), so in terms of being able to react to it, it’s possible but won’t always happen. It will still be a good mixup.

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IG went a little bit too far with nerf cancels to Wulf compared to the rest of the cast. A lot of the other nerfs to other characters were balanced with really good new tools. This leaping for medium slash is fairly weak as a new tool compared to what the rest of the cast got. I would’ve been fine with the nerfs to either Instinct Feral cancel or damage reduction, but not both. At least reduce the Feral cancel reduction cooldown.

One thing I think IG could’ve added to bring him in line with the other changes that the other characters got is a chargeable/cancellable eclipse similar to Jago new fireball mechanic. Basically down-up + P (hold to charge) or dash to cancel.

It’s a situational move that could be good for some mix ups.

It just seems when you add all of the nerfs together that he seems to be the hardest hit other than Kan-Ra.

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