LPT: Don't ever get hit by this button

I’m pretty sure he’s just saying any of Tusk’s slow sword buttons can be punished this way, not just cr.HP.

Stand MP is -3 and I think stand HP is only about -5 or so. So you can’t punish all of them. But you get your turn back and Tusk can’t really deflect in time if you try to do something and he’s reasonably close.

the reason why i listed this is to show that people dont know the matchup including me and you. He gets away with a lot of stuff atm. Did you know you can backdash st.hp on reaction and full punish cause it whiffed - no need too deal with deflection. i can backdash with jago and windkick punish a st.hp.

Simple as that. Its too early to mark something as too strong or braindead when you dont know how to play the matchup with your character with new moves and rebalanced stuff from s3.

I hate to say it but that is scrub mentality. Learn your character from ground up cause its a new season and adapt too all changes. Come back in a month and if you still can not beat Tusk reliable than explain why he is too strong.

Oh and if you cant beat a character and he is so dumb and strong - just play him and dominate all players.

4 Likes

Only his cr.hp is punishable on block by nearly all characters. st.hp only by dp characters

But to list it

st.hp can be backdashed and full punished, a dp with less than 5f punish (fulgore, Jago, maybe orchid dont know), parried, interrupted on reaction.
f+mp neutral jump on reaction and full punish
cr.hp full punish on block
st.mp is safe
cr.mp is more or less safe cause it has a lot of whiff recovery

And yet here People accuse Riptor of being mindless, but by comparison you can at least get her off you more easier than Tusk.

Personally I’m gonna follow the dev advice and not let Tusk the school bully pick on me. lol

Everyone else do the same. We can take down the school bully. Without tattling on the teacher : P

Also: you guys know hes only been out for a week right? we should wait awhile before calling for changes. Just try to fight as many Tusks as you can. And WIN IT!

All of this makes sense considering s.HP is pretty much “The Money Shot” so it would have to be real punishable on misuse.
Inversely I’ve been able to react deflect a number of attacks using it, like Rash’s wrecking ball, pretty consistently.

Also, Tusk can block low for any of Hisako’s rekkas:

  • Hisako’s MP and LP rekkas can be deflected on reaction using cr.MP, cr.HP, MP Skull Splitter (for MP rekka), MP and HP Conqueror.

  • Orchid’s overhead rekka can only be deflected with HP Conqueror.

  • Riptor’s tail flips after a blocked talon go:

  • LK can be deflected with basically anything on you want

  • MK can’t be deflected but it can be dashed out

  • HK can be deflected by a last second turn around cr.HP

  • Riptor’s Predator followups can be deflected as follows:

  • LP -> cr.MP/cr.HP/MP Splitter/MP/HP Conqueror

  • MP -> MP/HP Conqueror

  • HP -> Nothing, block high.

  • LK -> MP/HP Conqueror

  • MK -> cr.MP/cr.HP/MP Splitter/MP/HP Conqueror

  • HK -> MP/HP Conqueror

  • Arbiter’s overhead special done after his target combos can be deflected pretty easily with all the good buttons.

I’m really liking that there’s so far a lot of cool ways to set up a deflect by using the opponent’s momentum against themselves. There’s too much to test.

Based on 200 or so matches with Tusk so far, you pretty much shouldn’t be using s.HP unless to chase bad positioning or if you’re going for a deflect. Deflecting with s.HP instantly makes your combo lvl 3.

I just noticed this comment and I can’t disagree more.
Cr.MP is Tusk’s most reliable deflect while under pressure that can lead to a grounded combo since it doesn’t change to a proximity normal when someone is in your face or above you, and recaptures if they were. Cr.HP can deflect anything that cr.MP can, but it can only lead to juggles and those require Instinct.

1 Like

I never said he was too strong and unbeatable. I will admit to calling him a little mindless with some trap style gameplay, and perhaps that was premature, BUT I HAVE NEVER called for nerfs or changes to him. Only he be observed with a more careful eye to see if some of his tactics should or shouldn’t be reigned in a little. I’m not going to make that judgment call since it’s not mine to make, I just relearn the game as I have need to for competition.

What I don’t care for is the subtle insinuation of you calling me a scrub. I know my character well, but I’m learning a new matchup, and finding that Tusk’s cr. HP isn’t a poke so much as it is an effective anti-air and crossup tool. I don’t expect someone to throw it out in the neutral. I have encountered a tusk player that threw out skull splitter 4x in a row at its longest range, and even with Cinder, it’s a fairly difficult punish. I have my own observations and opinions of moves, and while they may conflict with yours, I can express them. Yes, some players I have encountered seem a little mindless in their playstyle, whether that’s a fault of theirs or mine, but I am allowed to say it strikes me as a little mindless. However, I’m tired of people putting words in my mouth saying I’m calling for nerfs, I NEVER SAID THAT.

I have come in here eliciting advice, to which I’ll take your advice on backdash punishes to the lab, it just wasn’t a consideration before since I was mostly looking for corner escape situations on these traps I’ve been seeing. From the number of Tusk players I’ve played, the corner is a REALLY bad place to fight or punish Tusk. I have also admitted to being a little salty on some posts. But if I’m just gonna get called a scrub for expressing opinion and asking advice, I can leave the thread. I’ve said my piece and am adequately resolved by a lot of the responses here, so if you feel my presence is unwelcome, say the word and I’m gone.

Well, I like Shadow Counters, but as Cinder, I try to reserve meter for other uses, but I’m probably going to have to change up things because at this point Shadow Counters are going to be extremely necessary for some of that long reaching offense he has going. I kinda like the white damage I get from the blocked shadow Inferno, but being on the offense is more important.[quote=“TrustfulWhale, post:56, topic:7679”]
I’m really liking that there’s so far a lot of cool ways to set up a deflect by using the opponent’s momentum against themselves. There’s too much to test.
[/quote]

This guy is finding ways to take advantage of this mechanic, like a good player will. It’s just I feel like for a lot of Tusk players, it’s the ONLY way of playing him from what I’ve seen, and there is no other real offense to him.

By the way @TrustfulWhale, not picking on you at all. Clarifying right now, respect to everyone in this thread. Even @LycanNaryko.

pretty much this. he’s new and not everyone knows how to deal iwth him yet, I play Tusk and get punished a lot by very good players for throwing out wild s.HP and s.MP. Tusk does not have a lot of safe options once you get used to fighting game. That orchid could have been punishing him all day.

Also a decent Glacius has no problem against Tusk. I watched GutterMagic struggle against quite a few Glacius players and lost a few as well.

Glacius is one of the hardest matchup for Tusk. I still don’t know what to do when he has those 3 projectiles things… and WTF is that liquidize fullscreen speed in Instinct mode???

Then next comes Shadow Jago :confused:

Shadow counters are WAY better this season and I think people (myself included) are really underutilizing them. I’ve been creamed by a lot of good players using Shadow counters in situation where they would not have worked in S2. I think this will be really important against the rushdown or high pressure characters like Rash and Shago. It works on Tusk too.

@TrustfulWhale way to go man. That’s you up in the top ten Tusks for number of Ranked wins right?

Wow, that is me. I didn’t know I was there…
Thank you for your support!

2 Likes

Jago has the same kinda situation except its with DP. The moments you try to punish Jago on his unsafe moves you have to be prepared for a Grab or DP in that window. Which can be very frustrating. As for Tusk if you keep getting hit by deflect on what you feel is a punish oppertunity then grab him as a punish instead. Tusk can’t deflect grabs. Also for some characters like Sabrewulf and Spinal they can avoid Tusk while he’s attacking due to his slowness. Wulf cam Dash through all of his normals and Spinal’s teleport is fully strike and fireball invulnerable. I can go on and on on how you punish Tusk and its only been a few days.

In my opinion on Tusk’s mix ups he only has one . Really good one. In his Immortal step you have three choices; Unsafe low, Semi-Safe Overhead, or Even Tackle. However you can actually press any normal out of a Immortal Dash as well when timed right on its last frame. People have tried to punish the dash itself only to run into my seemless St.HP Deflect Window. This also applies to command attacks. Immortal Spirit, final frame > F.MP = best mix-up Tusk has.

P.S. Immortal Spirit goes under Wind Kick.

Just put this in bold. By grabbing him, you accept a sub optimal punish but hopefully train your opponent NOT to try to deflect you after a punish opportunity. So next time when he expects a grab you can hit him harder.

This is underused, and actually pretty interesting part of his game. Both his sMK and sHK also have good range to add on to the end of this as well. Although both will be blocked by either a low or high block they aren’t nearly as unsafe as his slide and can sometimes catch somebody sleeping.

I’ve played the Hisako/Tusk match-up A LOT in the past few days. It’s kinda funny - about 70% of the match is played at roughly full-screen, jockeying for the middle… whiff punish fishing for days. Hisako and Tusk have the biggest “Swords” in the game, so Jago/Shago must feel woefully inadequate :wink:

1 Like

It was not meant to call you a scrub. It was a clear overreaction and that is a scrubby mentality. Just see it from the other side people that play him got labeled as braindead or mindless by you. Regardless if you meant it or not. Written stuff is easily wrong interpreted. just like i did with your previous posts. I assumed you wanted some nerfs for him cause you called him braindead or mindless.

Fair assessment. I make it a general rule to not blame the player, as any good player will take whatever advantage is afforded them. I do see where I poorly worded my earlier statements, and maybe I should correct myself a little.

I see a little too often the gameplan quickly dissolves into this style where you basically loop Tusk’s negative on block (and I’m talking the -5 or so buttons, not the -17) with other moves in order to actually time it to purposely catch the deflect window. I saw it frequently, almost every match I played. For a move that is supposed to be negative on block, it hardly felt like Tusk is ever at any disadvantage, and counterattacking no matter the timing was a pointless gesture. Normally a -5 on block should at least eat a jab, but frame perfect counterattacking isn’t exactly easy, and more often than not, a Tusk player can upon recovery go for a cr. MP which has an almost instant deflect window startup, making even the traditional jab punish useless.

These deflect window traps become a very common theme from the matches I played, and struck me as a little bit of a mindless deterioration of the character’s gameplan. Never any fault of the player using him, but something I felt maybe was overlooked in testing his playstyle. I’ve never called for him, or any character to my recollection, to ever be nerfed on these forums. I will say I disagree about some of Glacius’ changes, as an already strong character just got even stronger. It still takes sharp minds to make them viable.

So I’ll admit maybe I didn’t word it the best, and it’s certainly no fault of any player for using the tools at Tusk’s advantage. It just became a very common practice to see every Tusk match to eventually fall back on those deflect traps. I was probably prematurely writing off the tactic the way I did, but it’s how the gameplan struck me at the time, but it’s no fault of any player to use it to their full advantage. I’ve had people give me the same grief over using M.Bison’s aerial control in SF4 when everything he can throw out in that game is so easily beaten. Seriously, to beat Head Stomp, you simply walk backwards, and it loses to almost any aerial attack.

I will say I had a salty moment. After this week, when my playtime isn’t so limited by outside factors, I’ll be able to find a way to take advantage of the deflect trap game and see if there isn’t appropriate punishment of this tactic.

Simple answer for countering his deflect is to just grab him when you suspect one is coming. Pressure Tusk up close enough and he’ll probably be looking for a spot to sneak a deflect in; I usually am. That’s where you grab him.

1 Like

The more i play him the more i think he should simply stay as he is.

I played a lot of exhibition matches and a lot of ranked and i feel without his damage and deflect he would be the extremely bad.

1 Like

Don’t forget stagger, it was put into the game specifically to support his kit and make it work, after all.

I think it was fairly obvious these tools are what define him, which is why I’ve spent so much effort trying to scout as many guaranteed deflect opportunities as I can, and honestly is a big part of why I play Tusk. Deflect is really interesting and fun to do, it’s essentially a counter hit in reverse.
Keits said on stream that you’ll be deflecting by accident most of the time, but I’ve seen that the opposite is true for players who really sink into the character. In fact, Tusk players are going to have no choice but to learn how to deflect intentionally since using sword buttons is such a risk every time-- we have to make them count.

His Instinct is also very fun and interesting to use since it allows him to remove the weights for a brief moment to go completely ham on someone, which cannot be understated. Instinct cancels at important times have won me easily more than 100 games, and I still feel that I’ve barely explored his potential using it.

I think they have done a great job with his kit and yet again have made a unique fighter to join the roster. I’ve played a great many fighting games and I’ve never played as a character like Tusk before.

Although, I’ve also never played Weaponlord, so who knows.