@CrazyLCD made an effort to collect recent MU chart data from the community as the current data was getting a bit stale, especially after recent patches.

Here’s the updated data! Enjoy!


welcome back PAUL BAEEEE :heart_eyes:

@UATBNDaymein I agree totally with your sadira MU list!!!

@SoSRaGnArOk what do you think about?

Why there no Eyedol in list?


Because randomness makes him unviable kappa.p


@llPaulBll, I suggested in the previous one to do each MU between the two players to avoid contradictions, like both Shin Tristan saying that Thunder wins Kim, and Bastfree saying the opposite

Overall, I like the project, but I don’t like how some players are evaluating their characters.

There is a lot of downplaying for some characters, and the opposite for others IMO


Yeah, a list full of contradictions doesn’t have much value. There has to be a real discussion between all players involved that comes to a consensus on each matchup. Otherwise, you end up with…well, what we have now.


This list is so strange and mind boggling, I am so confused.


WAH since when did arbiter go down that far? (did i miss some major patch notes)

i mean the S and A tier seems accurate (Fulgore more A+ than S if you ask me), the rest i am not so sure

I wonder where Eyedol and Kilgore would go?

Feel free to organize that.

Let me know how it goes.


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ask me for Eyedol!
Chart confidence would be about 5% though, which doesnt seem to be a problem considering the others.

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Eh, data collection is always imperfect. This is what it is and I’m sure there’s some value in it. But as long as the methods are reported clearly everyone can decide for themselves whether it is meaningful.


I wasn’t part of the original plan and I merely only collected the data from players this time around but I’d assume that this list is merely just for fun and an experiment at best; Paul would have to clarify. Also realistically speaking sitting down every top player for the entire cast and having them play jury style to find a consensus to matchups would never happen. For the record I don’t agree with most of this new tier list but hey it’s just data.

I personally found the site interesting because it just gives an idea about how people feel about their characters more than an actual tier placements.

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Rofl. Spinal is D tier? And I’m a Glacius main. I wouldn’t put him in D.


I agree

My problem with all this is that the characters placement seems fixed to their feelings, and only their feelings. If you ask someone for(for example) TJ and says that wins all his MUs 9-1, then he will be S tier, since the chat confidence seems irrelevant to their placement.

Dunno, I insist, I like the idea, but I feel that the placement of the characters seems irrelevant

I mean, there are other ways to do it. A full round table discussion would be the most thorough, but you could also make a much better chart using the data that exists by basing placements on what each player thinks of the matchups, rather than ignoring everyone but the player that mains the character. It wouldn’t be perfect, but it would help deal with the situation you have now where basically every placement is based on data that’s contradicted by the rest of the list.


Pretty much this. The list is interesting in the same way it was before, but has the same flaws as well. You wind up with some pretty wonky character placements based on how the different specialists rate their MU’s.


Yeah this list seems off, even if we’re just measuring by MUs. The Top 5 aren’t surprising, but why are Kan-Ra and Aganos above Hisako and Cinder?


typo’s on my list, i have shago winning the gargos raam MU 6-4, an i definitely did NOT put spinal like that. Shago spinal is even 5-5

List doesn’t seem too bad, and I think trying to get a consensus on each matchup or getting more info from players than what they think each matchup is like for their mains is probably unreasonable. We probably just have to accept that players have underdeveloped and/or biased perspectives on many of their own matchups, which is probably down to things like the high complexity of the game, the smaller player base, and the amount of disengagement among competitive players this season. Probably the best way to improve the tier list is for everyone to play more KI and come back with more refined lists later on.

(EDIT: responding to withdrawn post?)

Let’s just say I still have lingering memories of the first one of these consensus lists.

There are definitely matchups and placements that I disagree with, but it’s got enough in the ballpark of being reasonable that I can live with it: four of the top 5 belong on top; the middle looks reasonable enough if you move Shago down and Mira, Riptor, Rash, and Hisako up; and obviously Arbiter, Glacius and Spinal should bubble up a few tiers.

I haven’t delved far into the matchups (nor am I likely to) but Jago and Fulgore don’t lose zero matchups, and I think Riptor draws or wins some of the matchups that Liger thinks she loses.

I don’t know, I see more some semblance of sanity in the list this time around.