Hi, how many frames do the KI characters take to be considered already “jumping”?
I wanted to know that to see if I can avoid a grab when in disadvantage after a block, instead of teching I wanted just to neutral jump and continue my offense (probably even punishing a whiff grab from my opponent).
Example, I attacked and am currently -2 onblock, Can I still try to jump? Is this jump coming out before the opponent’s throw or will it going to connect?
There are 4 frames of pre-jump frames where if you get hit you’ll be caught in a standing state. However these 4 frames are grab invulnerable so basically if you want to jump to avoid a grab it’ll always work on the very first frame. Since regular throws have 4 frames of start up you’ll be able to avoid throws on anything better than -5.
Thanks a lot man. You were on point!
There are actually 5 frames of prejump in KI.
It used to be some characters were less than 5, but in Season 3 they standardized it so every character is 5 frames of unthrowable prejump now. When you press up, you immediately become throw invincible, and then 6 frames later you finally leave the ground and can be thrown (with an air/anti-air throw) again. So those 5 frames you can be hit on the ground.
Source: When I did my testing for all the dash numbers, I also tested all the prejump frames. Only chunkless Aganos (4f) and 3 and 4 chunk Aganos (6 frames) have different prejump.
But yes, everything else SithLord said is true. If you are -4, you can hold up to avoid regular throw punishes because throws hit on the 5th frame (though it won’t save you from Raam’s 4f grab and 1f shadow grab).
Huh, I always thought it was 4. Then that means a button that’s active for 4 frames can catch both jump and backdash options. It also means that my RAMM st.HK setups have a 2-frame window, rather than 1.
Wait, so a chunkless Aganos can actually jump faster than everyone else (by 1 frame)?
You start the match with 2 and usually consistently have some; his speed boost helps with his lack of defense with no chunks so it makes sense to me for him to jump slightly faster.
He has one frame less of prejump than anyone else, yes. Whether you call that a “faster jump” is up for interpretation.
Considering I frequently lose against 4 frame throws when I do a 5 frame jab, yes, I’d say that it’s faster.
Throws are 5 frames, same as everyone’s fastest normal. (And in the interest of being pragmatic, I will say that Aganos’s only 5f normal is stand LK, if you are doing jabs, then you aren’t pressing a 5f button)
And yes, it’s faster, but what I mean is, it’s only one measure of a jump. The total duration of the jump is another measure (probably the most important one), and by that measure Aganos may not be “fast”.
To be clear, that s.LK is exactly what I am pressing when I say jab, so my point still stands - I still lose to throws.
Okay, but throws are not faster than normals. Throws are the same speed as jabs. They both hit on the 5th frame.
But which has priority?
I tested it at one point, but have forgotten. If I have free time in the next while, and remember to do it, I’ll test it again.
From the Keits man himself:
I made a chart about it. Here,
Priority system
Throw>Shadow>Special>Heavy>Medium>Light grounded
Throw>Special>Heavy>Medium>Light Air
Strikes trade with projectiles, projectiles>throws, throws>strikes
Projectile crush attacks>throws and non-character projectiles, and trade with strikes (any strength)
Character projectiles=crush projectiles> throws, trade with strikes (any strength)
Armor>strikes and projectiles loses to throws
Kryll armor> one strike, infinite projectiles, loses to throws
It’s a rock, paper, scissors game kinda
Strikes=projectiles (they can trade but only if th strike and the projectile hit a character hurtbox aka the green boxes around the character model), projectiles>throws (since a trade can never occur between these two at any point it’s whoever touches the character hurttbox first), throw>strikes
Thanks, Sith. That’s all I needed. Now I know not to try that. 
Kryll Armor is infinite through projectiles? Not sure how that is, I get stopped by Jago Endokoukens (Mostly the doubles in instinct) all the time.
Kryll armor can absorb an infinite amount of projectiles so as long as they aren’t shadow projectiles (which blow right through it.) I just double checked and raam just ran through 3 of jago’s endokuken’s before hitting him unfazed by them.
Musta been imagining it, probably got heavied at the end by something