Fulgore still too OP, nerf that sucker once more again!

#21

Indeed but it doesn’t mean you’ll win if you don’t know how to use those tools properly.

I consider myself a really decent Fulgore player and I know how to use his tools but I don’t win everytime cause the opponents I get matched up against know how to avoid the moves.

Tools don’t always mean everything. I’m sure you have your troubles in some cases.

#22

On a serious note (if this thread doesn’t spontaneously combust as soon as someone takes it the slightest bit seriously), I don’t want to see Fulgore nerfs. Yeah the character is strong – I don’t think he sucks anywhere on screen, he can run multiple gameplans really well and interpolate between them on a whim, pip cancels give him access to that extra checkmate in many interactions, he obviously has great defense – but KI is kinda about powerful toolsets, and strong Fulgore is an amazing thing to watch when in the hands of a player who has mastered him.

Anyway, broader thoughts incoming. Warning: long, probably flawed post.

My main worry with Season 3 has been that the game’s balance would finally cross the precipice to where it’s no longer about exploring powerful toolsets. A bunch of very shenaniganzy characters – Wulf, Kan-Ra, Sadira, etc – seemed to get neutered in the S3 rebalance, which I think has made the game unfun for many competitive players who made their names in Season 2 on the back of powerful mixup-driven offense, and don’t so much like being frustrated by characters like Jago and Fulgore who can run safe games with offense driven by frame traps and pokes and solid defense and force patience in their opponents, a kind of strategy which has had an honour seat at the S3 table. Since then there has been this building hunger for Jago nerfs, which have been dealt out in skirmishes that haven’t really tended to satisfy anyone. It seems like even more reasonable players like Bass think Jago is too strong in some fundamental ways, so I’m kinda just waiting for a serious Jago nerf, I guess? But I think that’d be the final straw, KI would be about fundamentally different stuff if you took away Jago’s unreactable midscreen combo starter or the fast meterless DP, or nerfed his frame traps in a meaningful way.

To my mind, there’s at least a strong top 7-or-so who are fine – Mira, ARIA, Omen, Fulgore, Jago, Hisako, Riptor – and a bunch of characters below them who could use something extra to hang with that crowd. I think Mira is S3’s Kan-Ra, the character has a lot of untapped potential and should develop into a monster with the kinds of players who are putting time into her, but I’d be glad to see that happen. I want to see the rest of the cast get buffed so they can hang with that top 7-or-so, because I think the things that are happening at that tier are fine and I want more characters to engage with that, and I don’t want to see a continued decline in powerful KI.

I also think that some respected people in the community have wrong-minded ideas about which characters are make the game fun when they’re strong and which characters just frustrate people. I like the game when Jago and Fulgore are powerful, sure, but there are plenty of people in the community who hate being frame trapped or feeling like they’re up against an impenetrable wall of mostly safe decision-making and strong defense, who probably see Jago as the fun police here to instill a regime of patience and boredom in the game. Those same people want to lock in Wulf, Shago or Kan-Ra and go crazy. Other players still want to lab out a character and be rewarded for it as the season progresses, which luckily we seem to have with Mira, but I think that makes balancing to minimize the chances of some zoner or shenaniganzy character running away with the game a bad idea: lab monsters will be less engaged if they feel like the game is being deliberately contoured to contain a character. My main point is that what I want from game balancing is a god-honest attempt to make everyone viable and no-one too good, and I never want to see anyone promote a good/bad for the game approach to balance ever again, because it’s so subjective and it makes people hate the game.

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#23

Now you are talking about player skill and not character tool set. Of course, “tools don’t always mean everything” - nobody said other wise.

And you are right, I too have troubles with certain players… not characters - Fulgore still has an answer to everything, hence… he is still too good and IMO Keits will find something to adjust.

#24

Stop trolling your not funny. But if your serious then I ask you if Fulgore is so good why isn’t he dominating the competitive scene or ranked. Why is he not getting complained about as much as kan ra did just something to think about

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#25

Jago has an answer for everything but it doesn’t mean he’s gonna win everything.

Fulgore is fine where he is. If you wanna have a better challenge then I think it’s time you mained another character.

#26

Yo @JEFFRON27 don’t get butt hurt bro, its all fun and games anyway. This thread was in no way meant to down play the bot or your play style. I can see you like the robot, I do too… I have tried all other chars and they don’t feel like my cup of tea.

You feel the robot doesn’t need any more nerfs, I believe Keits will find something soon enough and Fulgore will once again get a the nerftastic treatment he is used to…

#27

Is Fulgore good at everything? Yes.

Is that justification for a nerf?
Is he too good at something in particular?
Are his weaknesses irrelevant?

I think especially now he doesn’t get free meter from instinct the answer to the all of these is no. I think he’s still the best in the game and will be by nature, but doesn’t really have anything particular that needs toning down now really. Even the crazy unbreakable into dev beam into one chance stuff that he can get with full bar and instinct requires him to get both of those things through smarter play and resource management.

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#28

None of this makes sense. And you’re mistaking saltiness for genuine confusion.

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#29

yea thats it!

#30

Are you having a stroke? Can you raise both arms? Do you smell toast?

#31
#32

Ah, shucks. I fell for the troll.

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#33
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#34

They can nerf his Ultra by giving him an ultimate.

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#35

these people have no idea or haven’t come to the realization of what fulgore can do. to everyone else…me and ninexnine are top 2 of the leaderboards. I’m not even that good but I seriously get away with murder even with his recent nerfs. honestly I think fulgore is so good people just can’t control him with ninja like reflexes. it’s almost too much bot

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#36
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#37

Don’t nerf him, I’m just getting the hang of him!

Really though, he does feel like a jack of all trades and pretty good at most of them. Like, if you scored characters out of attack, defence, agility etc he’d probably have sixes and sevens across the board.
Of course, previously that might have been eights and nines.

But how many times can you change a character? Look at Season 1 Fulgore and compare him to now, they’re fundamentally different. Even now, they only just changed his instinct mode. Although, I’d like to take another look at S1 Fulgore to see what we can learn and if some of that play style can be incorporated back into him.

Personally I struggle with meter gain, I’m only amateurish compared to many of you so maybe I’m playing him wrong but it just seems to be so slow to me.
I’d bring back manual charging outside of Instinct, though maybe it could increase reactor spin speed rather than straight up grant pips?

But we’re talking nerfs, so what if hype beam went back to being an Instinct-only move? Don’t get me wrong I would hate to see that because it’s my Shadow Lords crutch of choice, and I don’t know how integral a move it is in high-level play. Would it really change anything?
Maybe make it consume Instinct meter like Shago, but do more damage the fuller it is?

I’d also like to see horizontal eye laser range reduced because I really hate full screen projectiles, but I’d bring back the anti air one. I mean maybe they have been changed, I don’t really use eye laser.

#38

He probably got his ■■■ kicked by another fulgore and cant take it.

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#39

TacoLord, stop playing drunk and you may just git gud…lol

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#40

I cant, i need my drink =) but im down to fight you when i get home from work, show me what moves you have that you think is op and ill show u mine, he might be a lil op but i think any character can be that way with enough practice

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