Dealing with pressure

#1

So, I get that Fulgore’s offense is still crazy, but with his instinct change and the previous changes of teleports much more dramatically affecting spin speed, how in the hell do you actually deal with someone who constantly throws themselves at you? I’ve literally played games where I only have 2 pips after my first life bar (and that’s without spending any!)

I feel like his inability to shadow counter was overlooked when his rebalance changes were made, in retrospect, I’d prefer faster spin speed and it requiring 2 pips to cancel so that I at least have a chance of defense against pressure heavy characters.

But anyway, how do people deal with pressure heavy characters? Is it really just DP and pray it doesn’t whiff/get blocked? If that’s the case then I think I might finally have to pick a new character because that’s pretty awful, even if his offense is still great. I feel like we’re back to season 1 where if you never caught a break all you could do was sit in the corner and block.

#2

I actually had an ft10 against a very offensive Fulgore (which I’m not used to, I expect a more zoning or heavy vortex set up cyborg when they fight against Wulf). He confused me using a lot of heavy low mix up (which is very strong and very hard to react, since the overhead is pretty fast and the light laser would hit low inmeadiately). You play a lot of mind games with the forward HP and medium laser (watch out for shadow counter though) and c.LP and c.MK. DP to get out of pressure is extremelly good (I fell for it and I wasn’t expecting the rival to go so happy Dping, but that’s my fault). He wasn’t afraid to dp at all. Also, the teleports are very confusing.

About the meter, you are right, Fulgore can’t easily shadow counter most of the time and when he does and doens’t get it it’s also frustrating because you know you threw pips to the oblivion, and that hurts.
Because I know he can’t shadow counter I would go happy ragged edge most of the time, but it wasn’t that smart either. It can be punished and I can’t press buttons after it.
I still believe that Orchid could be also hard for Fulgore now without a lot of meter…Can’t be sure anyway. Fulgore has some nice offensive and zoning, and a dp will do for good pressure riddance. However, it’s a gamble.

Chech this set if you want. A very agressive Fulgore (I din’t punish jumps properly…Now I’m rewatching the fight to do better next time).
01:35:08 - 02:26:00 (I think he chosed Jago for 2 matches but I know the mu better).

PS: The cyber dash cancel into dp is really something…

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#3

It’s good to have pocket characters in KI, the game is that diverse. Being a character specialist will get you really far, but won’t keep you top forever. If you want to run sets tomorrow we can, I main Fulgore and won’t ever ditch the bot. Pressure is hard sometimes, but there are other ways out. Block the normals, contest the mixup, that’s where you’ll get out.

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#4

Fulgore has a DP and one of the best backdashes in the game. If your opponent is mindlessly running offense on you, just pull the trigger and you’ll probably be rewarded. If you’re worried about the DP being baited, that means your opponent is giving you some breathing room in their pressure, which means you’ll have opportunities to escape pressure with jabs, throws, and movement.

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#5

Well, a DP is one of the best possible defensive tools, and you’ll need to learn to use them effectively whether you’re playing Fulgore or anyone else. I’m not even really sure what better tool you want to give someone on defense that doesn’t immediately break the game.

If your opponent is running offense mindlessly, then DP will work a large percentage of the time. If they try to bait your DP, then that means the tool has done its job and now you have forced them to block while they have advantage, which means you steal turns back from your opponent. Smartly applying offense to DP characters, and smartly stealing your turn back just with the threat of DP on defense, is kind of fighting games 101.

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#6

He has a meterless DP and one of the best backdashes in the game. This shouldn’t even be a discussion :confused:

Less flippantly, what Climax and Infil said.

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#7

Ease up on him he’s my friend :joy:

#8

The “weakness” (it pains me to say this) of fulgore is that he’s SUPPOSE to get ran over by offense. If you would like a character who has better defensive tools then. . . . . .fulgore may not be your main character anymore. Having access to a shadow counter is nice, but also having access to a 50/50 (overhead, low, left, right mix up and at worst can be even) vortex that builds meter and okizumi is better, MUCH better. If fulgore had a better access off meter to get that defensive you are also buffing offense, which is already scary.

I feel fine with fulgore having to okay the dp or no dp game. I also feel like a great fulgore player knows when to intimidate ppl with that dp and take their turn back.

Paramisery, as a good friend of mine, if you are not having fun with fulgore because of his nerfs, by all means, play another character (i like your thunder). If you still are having fun with fulgore, i think changing your gameplan by backdadhing a little more (sf4 backdashes that are invincible in the first couple frames btw) and patience (Sitting and blocking) is how you play it now.

Multiple characters in KI have poor defensive traits but great players like @STORM179 take advantage of that.

#9

honestly shadow counters are over rated. instead of blowing 4 pips on a brakeable combo just manual the crap outta everything with pips or without them. fake a meaty for a whiff then teleport right back in front of them for a punish. I mean he has like 5 shadow moves for every situation he finds himself in. use the force Luke.

#10

that guy who played fulgore is BH indiria. and woe to anyone who fights his fulgore. that’s some next level ■■■■ right there. I’m telling you. fulgore is almost to much to handle.

#11

This isn’t true at all. As pointed out above by three people already, Fulgore has a meterless DP and an excellent backdash. Fulgore’s defense is excellent.

3 Likes
#12

See. . . . . . . .this is why i used quotations on weakness. I agree with everything everybody is saying. I’m just saying that in KI, meter is used as defense in a lot of instances.

With shadow meter, you can get passed zoning by using projectile invincible moves. You can use meter to make unsafe reversals really safe. You can use meter to shadow counter opponents for pressure buttons.

By all meansv when fulgore has pips his defense is EXCELLENT, and without pips he has access to a dp and backdash, which are VERY GOOD. but if your opponent is fairly aggressive in their approach, fulgore will find it hard to come by 3 pips without taking a his turn back by force.

By no means do i think having access to a dp makes your defense excellent, it’s a 50/50 risk. You either take your turn back or eat 10% guaranteed optimal damage for a combo.

I think jago has WAY better defense than fulgore because he can come by Meter better and get past pressure situations in a variety of ways.

#13

There’s less of this in the game than there used to be. You should be getting punishes on Jago’s shadow fireball-cancelled unsafe antics, for example.

This is also the case with a shadow counter attempt, except that you also burn the meter whether it catches something or not.

The meter isn’t without use in defensive situations. You typically get a combo off a shadow counter, and there are multi-hit moves you can catch on reaction during blockstun that you can’t DP out of due to being in blockstun.

But there isn’t a huge rift between the defensive capabilities of Jago and Fulgore. Certainly Fulgore’s defense is among the best in the game.

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#14

you guys are both right really. his defense. I think that the cat chases its tail on this one. yea fulgore had teleports which can be used defensively at cost of meter potential. but after that were right back in the circular conversation you guys are currently having.

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#15

I mean lets really break this down. backdash is only good to bait throws, jabs and mixups that people ■■■■■ up. it’ll get blown up by anything forward moving and since the better dashes rely on meter I’m not so sure it’s that great. I dunno. fulgore has a million ways to burn meter and a million more ways to get countered and rekt. I do think the odds are stacked against him tho.

#16

I dunno about you but a single move that can blow up that many options seems pretty good. Even if its not his ice skates dash which is even better.

#17

It’s BM Inidria (BH is from US). He has a very agressive Fulgore indeed.
I tried to pick Fulgore against a very fundamentals player (and very grounded player) and he took me out of everything with just Wulf’s jabs. Very annoying honestly. When I tried to have some space he would just yolo slide or either use overhead. I should have dp more on his aproach when running (Wulf’s hamstring would go under cyber dash, so it’s tricky).
But he would fell for cyber dash cancel intro dp more times that I have fallen for it XD
I’ll try to fight him again to check the match up. I still believe that if zoned out Wulfs has it hard against Fulgore. He still has buttons to face the bot in close range (IMO)

TBH I wasn’t expecting to do ok. I was afraid I was going to be destroyed since I’m not playing the game enough.
Oh, if people like watching Kan Ra there’s also a very good Kan Ra in the last ft10 =) (AncientTrain)
This ft10 matches were very funny and it feels good to have some practice and training. Thanks for the Chilean community for organizing these matches.

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#18

oh you mean his DP? he blows up some shadow counters it’s like 6 characters he can blow up shadow counters with. so yea I get what u mean. but lots of characters can blow up shadow counter or stuff them. so it isn’t really special. and most DP end up as a trade anyways. which is neutral. I dunno. I think it’s a complicated subject depending on who talking about it.

#19

So, just out of curiosity, does anyone here other than Sullen Mosquito actually play Fulgore? Or is this just the obligatory “He’s far and away the best character in the game” line of thought?

I’m continually getting blown up by pressure, DP is not working for me, while not every character has a dp, those that do either trade or beat fulgore’s and in the case of a trade, he floats higher and lands later, giving them pressure advantage. I’m genuinely at a loss for what I’m even supposed to do when my opponent is in my face and I have no meter, my reward for blocking 10 seconds straight is a slowed reactor speed.

I appreciate the help, but even from the videos it almost looks like I should just play recklessly offensive and hope for the best.

On a side note, I’m also genuinely curious why people still think he’s the best. I won’t argue that he was the best at the end of s2 and start of s3, but after like 6 rounds of nerfs and the fact that nobody mained him at KIWC (Nicky did use him of course, but he used Mira more and he was the ONLY person to use him), why do people think he’s still so amazing?

#20

Well, my apologies for being so stupid, I’m clearly beyond dumb because DP and backdash don’t work for me against very pressure oriented opponents, which is why I posted here.