#BelieveInKeits

General Discussion
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That’s because they patched the ever-loving crap out of S2 throughout its ongoing release. S2 had a major patch every month, and it wasn’t until the last 2 or so characters were released that the other characters stopped seeing at least incremental tweaks. S2 changed (sometimes considerably) very often - they had no need of a major revision by season’s end. The big-ticket items of community feedback (return to neutral on breakers, end of instinct->shenanigans) instead just got rolled into S3’s launch.

For myself, there are about three or four big character changes/adjustments I’d like made, but after that it’s pretty much all gravy. I have almost no expectation regarding how they’re going to “fix” the game, because by and large I don’t think it’s broken.

I personally believe S3 KI to be the best iteration of the game thus far, and I also think it’s the most balanced. There’s some nonsense in it still, but on the whole there’s much less of it, and none of it rises to the towering heights of nonsense we sometimes had in S1 and S2 (except Eyedol - that was ridiculous :joy:). There are tweaks to be made, and after this patch there will still be tweaks to be made, but I’ve honestly been having a blast with the game since March. As I’ve always said, I’ll keep playing KI as long as it’s fun. I’ve traveled to and participated in tournaments now as well, but end of the day those aren’t why I play and they sure as hell won’t be why I stop. As long as I’m having fun and can find matches online, I’ll be playing KI and enjoying every minute of it.

The team has done a ■■■■ fine job with this game - I don’t need them to come out with the “perfect” patch for me to believe in their work.

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62

That’s fine. These players’ opinions are valuable. They should engage in an active discussion with the devs on what they think is wrong with the game, be prepared to debate calmly and rationally and provide evidence (and also be prepared to not win every single point, because sometimes opinions will differ). If they start finger pointing, meme-ing, or spouting personal insults, the devs will probably not listen to them, even if they have something very valuable to say.

But if what these players say is actually true, and they debate it like respectful adults, what they say will be heard. If it hasn’t been heard yet, then the barriers of communication are broken in some way, and they have to be repaired. And that is a job on both sides, not just IG’s.

The truest thing you’ve ever said. I know you’re running a podcast tonight about the state of KI, I hope you are approaching it with this attitude in mind.

I think it probably is as well, but I just want to make sure the community is prepared for “many” good fixes and not “the entire game is now fixed the way we like it”.

Bass was posting on facebook earlier where he says he thinks the risk/reward is out of whack for some characters. He listed some characters that make sense, and then some characters that surprised me a bit. Let’s say patch 3.4 addresses, to pick a random number… 60% of the characters that the community agrees has out of whack risk/reward, and leaves another 40%, some of which might still be consensus picks, while the others are debatable and much less clear examples.

Is this a successful patch to you? The game is clearly moving towards a better state by the metric of the players, even if it doesn’t get all the way there yet and maybe some particularly frustrating things remain in the game (but many other frustrating things are fixed).

The reason I’m making this post is to make sure that, if patch 3.4 does this, that the feeling is not negativity towards the things that remain in the game, but rather positivity about the improvement the game has made. Because it’s very easy to get down on 1 thing that’s still around that you hope would have been fixed, and easily forget about the 10 other improvements to the game.

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Best post of the year. /end thread

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Well said sir

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Yeah, I mostly agree. I think it undersells the relatively decent balance (not without its share of flaws, mind you) that the game already has. And there’s never been a very good reason to doubt the developers’ long-term responsiveness to the community’s feedback in the first place.

Honestly, I wouldn’t be surprised if the developers waited this long to start doing major re-balances because they were observing how S3 would turn out after a few months and wanted to avoid the same criticism they got for never letting S2’s balance settle until the end of its active course.

While I absolutely appreciate players like LCD for trying to be positive, it’s a bit disappointing that this general drama and gloom over the current state of the game has to start again after the developers have announced a big re-balance patch that has undoubtedly considered a lot of our grievances and frustrations. It comes off as mostly redundant and exaggerated to me, which might hurt the game more by further engendering negative attitudes in the community than it helps by further stressing complaints/feedback in the big picture.

On top of this being exaggerated and untrue, personal criticisms toward the the developers are pointless to be discussing and certainly not constructive toward our goals. We want to build and maintain bridges with respectful dialogue, not burn bridges with distrust and insults.

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You’re too sensitive. No criticism has been made or insults directed at a member of the dev team. It has merely been observation up to now. One that I’m qualified to make due to extensive training and work experience working with social interactions and behavior management.

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I love the double standards. If I were to say KI sucked “which I don’t think, I love this game” people would tell me to just quit playing. If I offered ideas on game play, then I would hear “what do you know, or that is stupid”. When a pro says something, we all should just listen and agree.

I don’t get why “pros” think their thoughts are move valuable than anyone elses. Most pro requests are either about making their main character better, or fixing something they feel is a problem for them.

Now LCD, so you talk to pro players, do you want a medal? I assume you wrote that, because you think that your opinion matters more. It doesn’t.

There are several of us who come to this fourm everyday. We start threads, ask questions, and help other players. You don’t need to come to the fourm every few months, and act like you have some new info to enlighten us with.

There is rarely Kiets bashing here in the fourm. That is done on Twitch streams by pros.

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Whatever the intention, claiming that someone habitually feeds off attention and drama is indeed a judgement and criticism of character.

I’m not being sensitive, nor did I say you were necessarliy trying to be disrespectful. I’m just pointing out that personal comments aren’t constructive to the discussion, especially toward the decision-makers we have to work with. The most they do is create beef and distrust that interfere with communication and progress on these issues. It’s practical to avoid.

However qualified you may consider yourself, it’s still very debatable and not a very solid or relevant point to make the in the first place.

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Man, I came in here expecting “Ah dude Keits usually knows best, he’ll get it done, we trust him”

Instead I got 50+ paragraphs of people explaining how people will end up quitting the game and moving on, or that this game’ll never be perfect… Well, I mean, on the first one, of course, people tire from everything eventually, it’s just a matter of when. If it’s when a specific patch or something comes out, or they just get flat out bored with the game, that’s natural. And on the second one… If you want this game to be “Perfect” with literally no flaws, I’m gonna have to point in the direction of the “Literally no game is perfect- every game has flaws of some kind, something someone will always complain about” Lounge for your complete stay.

The characters currently need tweaks, yes, that’s true, but ranting about how “uh, well, they don’t REALLY need tweaks, people just overreact all the time and always think each version is broken” is a crappy way to deal with it. On the other hand, people ranting about “Every character needs major tweaks, they’re all pretty bad/broken/etc. Especially my main who needs Wake Up Invulnerability on every attack because they’re under-performing right now” Need to A) Git Gud or B) Honestly stop playing if the game is actually too complicated for you to understand. Which by the way, completely can happen, there are people who won’t be able to fully understand how the game works and will either complain or quit the game because of it.

Can’t we all agree that Killer Instinct in it’s full current state is an amazing game that in all honesty could use tweaks?

Uh… Stupidly long rant with probably infinitesimal contradictions and holes over… I added to what I was originally complaining about, didn’t I? Maybe I should just not talk anymore. Yeah. That’s a good idea.

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You just described me in detail.

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You’re behaving in an asinine manner. Soapboxing your psychoanalysis of a person in a public venue without a good reason to be doing so is antisocial behaviour, it’s an abuse of the qualifications you claim to have, and if I were a moderator I’d’ve issued you a warning for it by now. Stop doing it.

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Post this on a thread called “Common sense call”, one on each sub forum, and I will vote it to be pinned.

@BigBadAndy forpresident

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This is the result I’m sure they anticipated with Having such a forum where they wanted the users to voice their opinions and help shape the game itself…

It seems as some wrapped their whole existence in this game and what it provided for them (subscribers witnessing them winning or losing?) as opposed to the initial joy everyone seemed to feel that summer we all felt when the game was announced. Guess some started losing and were literally salty in real life wow

Maybe I fell into that pot of people who were whiners, I have been one of those who was repetitive about orchids oddly animated face/ clavicle and last Gen hair and retro having the wrong length boots in 2014- and while kim Wu gameplay mechanics may be a different issue,

BUT

but i learned to live with the lack of change in my own favor or what only I personally feel is artistically appropriate and love ki for what it is- the Frankenstein of video games! My fave of all time is back- I’ve play this game almost every day since I’ve had it.

Almost every day. And I’m not a twitch ‘pro’ who happens to stream and have subscribers or drive to the nearest Convention Center to play against 12 others for a cash prize. I don’t believe in the separation of people regarding whether they enter contests or play solo every day after work.

And I will never stop playing it, paper hair and mismatched retro costumes and all.

Because I believe in KI.

I never predicted theaddition of orchids grenade trait before Keits genius of season 2- I never predicted kims fireflower evolution to dragon cannon and this Man is remarkably responsible for at least 5 most fin female fighters I have ever played in my life!
I feel the game developers are doing a great job- id love to see some character design/ costume addition growth, but I’d grade this game a B plus!

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While I’m not disagreeing with you, I find it funny that you try to use bigger, more complicated words to try and make your point - it’s akin to speaking slowly and loudly at someone who doesn’t speak your language in the hopes that they’d somehow understand you…

SIGH

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What big complicated words? Asinine? :neutral_face:

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A few uptight “pros” in the community equals the majority, didn’t you get the memo?

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You’re welcome to your opinion, so am I. However, you certainly don’t have any right to tell me what to do or say. Why don’t you cool down, keep your emotions in check, and realize you are worked up over nothing. No one needs you to be their white knight. Keits is an adult and is certainly capable of taking care of himself.

You don’t have to agree with my observations or my opinions, but you don’t get to imply I’m asinine because I have them or expressed them either. Ironically, you’ve issued an insult out of your misunderstanding, when I have not directed an insult or attack at the party of discussion.

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Cool it, people! We’re all smart enough to know where this back-and-forth goes, and it’s not good, so let’s just stop it while you’re both ahead of the curve or else the both of you will crash and burn. :blue_car::fire::motorcycle: = :head_bandage:

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It most certainly is not. Plenty of people feed off the drama of others, many are celebrities and performers. Simply stating an observation about a person’s behavior does not equate to a personal attack or insult. No amount of you or another party interjecting your own negative connotations changes that.

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This isn’t a conversation about what Keits says on Twitter, more about the upcoming update. This is getting off topic and needs to switch to this. Keep your opinions about his implications or motives in an appropriate topic or what have you but there’s little need for them here.

Keep it to this topic or we’re closing up shop.

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