I fully understand why arby received most of these adjustments. But I don’t agree with making his shadow overshield more negative when people was already baiting this move already! I am super upset with this change, this just doesn’t make any since to me. Adding on to the fact, he has no true wake up or answers for jump ins unless you Preemptively throw out C.Hp or beat them air to air. I am beyond disappointed because I feel it was very unnecessary to make this move -11 form -1 which also deals 0 damage.
I agree that overshield was a pretty overrated reversal. Considering its only purpose was to give him 7% health that could easily be taken away (by, you know, baiting the shield pop itself), was it being safe really that big of an issue?
Now you’re only really gonna want to use this for stopping jump-ins, making lunges safer and for grenade setups.
Hey at least we got carbine damage back though XD
True…! But losing a big Defensive tool hurt him more simply because jump gun has a restriction on his shoots. Also being limited on those shoots, so having more defensive tool would be more important imo.
I think they’re just trying to emphasize Arbiter’s weaknesses and also trying to nerf his approach and runaway options (jump gun) as well.
Was it too much? Time will tell. You’re gonna have to be really good at controlling neutral or your opponent’s gonna run all over you.
I kinda agree with this change in particular . An opponent baiting the overshield would either tak it on block therefore making the move safe or take some distance, wich could be seen. With some practice you could activate the shield on reaction only on the first case and never on the second.
And after that the move was just a safe “get away” move.
Now you’ve got the grenade suicide that require more commitment but can pay off wayyyy more if set up correctly. That make me think that arby is more than ever a setup character and trust me, I’ve already discoved realy good tech with overshield and suicide combo.
But i don’t realy like the air carabine change, throw me off way too much.
Over shield was -1 and was never intended to be a reversal, its main function was to armor up for incoming projectiles. I truly understand that but you have to take this into consideration, IT COST METER, IT DOES 0 DAMAGE. Just because it pushes you back doesn’t mean it my turn again to attack. There are characters like Jago/Wulf/fulgore Maya that are PLUS, CHIP, and more importantly there are plus on shadow moves that travel across the screen. This is another argument for a different topic I will say this though. SHADOW MOVES THAT TRAVEL ACROSS THE BOARD SHOULD NOT BE PLUS! SAFE OR NEGATIVE AT MOST. Examples: shadow windkick/Shadow cyber dash. Examples of characters not being plus that travel: orchid shadow run car/ aria shadow knee slide. Like I said this is a different topic but this has always bothered me if you’re going be plus on your shadow traveling move why is mine negative with less better buttons then your character. Please just make this rule apply to all characters that have traveling shadow moves! Do not pick in choose
I think the overshield change was mostly to prevent making any move safe by canceling into it. I could be wrong, but that was a pretty great use of overshield in my opinion…
Yes this would make sense but going back too other characters like jago that can full screen windkick into Shadow fireball to make himself safe. Not to mention CHIP DAMAGE. You see where I get at? Lol
Arby was negative and didn’t get rewarded at all besides being safe. Others are plus on there shadows do some type of chip. Which arby does neither.
Overshield being safe once baited was kind of dumb to me. Why should a character who supposedly has bad defense get a move on wakeup that “beats” anything that’s not a block (excepting counters and other shenanigans) and gives health to him, and isn’t punishable if baited? If you use it and you hit the guy with overshield, cool beans, you’ve earned your space; you get your life-adding move baited, then you deserve to get dunked. If Wulf or Maya or anyone else with a metered reversal gets their reversal blocked, they’re getting dunked. I see no compelling reason why this shouldn’t be the case for Arbiter.
And plenty of characters have no answers to meaty jump-ins on their wakeup. You still need to safe jump both Arbiter’s shield overcharge and his grenade reversal - that’s more than a lot of characters get defensively. Arbiter is a very potent character on knockdown; he shouldn’t get to just hit the “reset to neutral” button the way he could earlier whenever it’s him on his back. He should take real risks to get his space back the way other defensively-challenged characters have to.
First of all yes shadow shield WAS very punishable on whiff for 3.3 pre patch if you watch previous tournaments me vs Bass and others I got punished several times actually from baits. Also again there are characters that get a free get aways into shadow something to making themselfs safe or plus using shadow meter which also chips there opponent health which arbiter did not!
Also maya and wulf are bad examples for explaining the safe wake ups comparing to arby. Let’s talk about characters that do have the options to do so, which are jago,fugore, omen etc. These characters can wake upwith something negative and make either safe or plus into a Mix up. Theirs no debating that!
How can Omen do this? Light orda into shadow form?
Yes but not sure what’s his shadow moves called but reversal into shadow move
Most of the cast can do that. Invincible reversal into shadow move.
I’m not talking about about on whiff, I’m talking on block. I don’t think you should have to stand at special ranges to make reversal-type moves whiff in order to be able to punish them. Particularly since overshield didn’t actually lose to anything. And I’m personally philosophically against the idea that invincible reversals should be able to be made safe through use of meter - it’s the one change I really wish had made it into the 3.4 patch but didn’t. That mechanic is degenerate and eschews players making meaningful decisions about how they want to handle pressure. If you want someone to get off you, then you should have to commit to that attempt.
Except that they’re really not. They are characters, like Arbiter, who have to use meter to attempt to get out of pressure. Jago, fulgore, et al aren’t analogous, as they are gifted with meterless reversals in the first place. Other characters who use meter to wake up don’t generally get to make themselves safe if their attempt is blocked. That’s the comparison that should be made when discussing the safety of Arbiter’s wakeup options.
I believe light orda->shadow lightning legs is the preferred Omen version of this, since he gets good frames off that one.
Ugh if you want to get back on offense then yes it is. You could also might orda then shadow form.
What’s wrong isn’t Arby losing the ability to have an inv reversal and remain safe. That’s just a perfect change. What’s wrong is other characters having the chance to cancel reversals into safe shadow moves.
This is basically the one change they didn’t make in 3.4, that I was hoping we would get. Make it so any fully invulnerable or strike invulnerable special isn’t shadow cancelable on block.
As for Arby’s shield, I honestly can’t believe someone didn’t think it was dumb for the move to be safe. Arby should never have had that to begin with. A fully inv special that gives him health and a way to bypass projectiles, pushes the opponent away and is safe on block? It made 0 sense. It was braindead and completely degenerate, if you ask me. Arby had basically 0 thought to put in his wake up, and if his opponents wanted to punish it they were forced to bait the shield with either neutral jump or backdash, putting themselves in risky and punishable situations if the arby player didn’t actually do the shield!
So if light orda is blocked he can cancel into shadow flurry kick to remain safe?