Annihilation move is OP. take it out


Unless you get a solid instinct into a right away cancel,it seems that using his base instinct without the super would be more beneficial.



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I wonder if it even does 48% at all, or rather you are Left with 42% health. If you look at the life bar after the max power Annihilation it will look more like 58% health was taken. Maybe my eyes deceive me but more than Half of your health is gone while the move signifies it rips less than half.


This is a bug. It will be reduced to 48% as indicated.


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Omen’s Demonic Despair > Shago’s Annihilation

Demonic Despair can grab you pretty much right out of block stun and is just about un-reactable if the person knows how to set it up. And your white health recovers SO FREAKIN SLOW. I think it is severely underused by Omen players.

Annihilation on the other hand is like one of the slowest moves in the game. You can jump out of it or hit him out of it at point blank range well after the flash.

Now, the Aganos shadow ruin thing I could definitely see being a problem. You just would need to watch his instinct bar and not do shadow ruin when it’s full.


The difference is Demonic Despair can only punish DP’s and doesn’t guarantee damage. Annihilation can punish a ton of stuff and is guaranteed damage. Also Annihilation is like 20 frames faster than Demonic Despair, anything you can do to escape it you can do to Demonic Despair with much slower reaction times.


I’ve got enough evidence right here
The above is a video Maximillian recently uploaded titled “Double Ultra Douchebags”. In it, he tries the Annihilation atleast twice and fails horribly, one time even being face to face with Orchid and still not landing it.
This is the best (well until someone else pops in with something better) proof you could need.


I’ll have my Annihilation video up by the end of this weekend at latest :smile: (not that it’s better or worse than what you posted to make your point)

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Hey, totally not against it being better. In fact, I kinda want this thread closed as soon as possible so we can all move on to more debatable things.

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No way is Demonic Despair slower. I’ve never once been able to react fast enough to jump out of that move online. You pretty much have to be holding up before the flash unless you have godlike reactions and a perfect connection to your opponent (which ain’t happening even with KI).
I’ve jumped out of Annihilation a ton of times just in the last week. Jump back+HK into a full combo = a complete waste of meter for Shago 95% of the time.


It is, Annihilation is only like 6 frames, Demonic Despair is 26 frames. The difference is that Annihilation’s 6 frames start after the freeze and Demonic Despair’s 26 frames take place before the freeze.


Demonic Despair is 0 frames after the freeze. If you didn’t jump before the freeze, it’s too late. But it has 25 frames of startup before the freeze, so it’s very slow (it won’t punish most moves, it gets hit by buttons, etc).

Annihilation is, to the best of my knowledge, 1 frame before the freeze and 5 frames after (or maybe 2+4). It is way, way, way faster, but you aren’t hitting people with it because the super freeze lets them jump for free if they haven’t committed.

Annihilation is the better move, for sure.


Annihilation is Instinct Freeze,plus Super freeze,plus 5-6 frames to avoid. Demonic despair is 26 frames,freeze,and zero frames after,


annihilation is almost the same as the ultimate. it just doesn’t belong there.

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Completely overpowered, either needs to be nerfed or removed all together.

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thanks god someone who understand whats happens on that update

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As promised:


As an aside, if you are point blank, attacks will not work (they are too slow and will get caught in startup). The only ones that do work are the incredibly fast shadow moves (Sadira shadow demon blade, maybe Wulf shadow ragged edge) that are faster startup than jabs. All the examples you’ve shown in the video were not point blank, so Shago had to take extra frames to travel, which lets the attacks come out. Obviously if you do an attack that is fully throw invincible the whole way, then it doesn’t matter how fast or slow it is (like DPs, or shadow wind kick).

It’s great to know the full properties of the move, but my advice is that the only punish you really need to know is “hold up-back”. You will jump over the command grab and get a full grounded punish of your choice (so, heavy into shadow opener if you want). If you can’t jump, then you were going to get hit no matter what, so it’s really a totally binary thing. Even if you can do shadow wind kick on reaction, you’re better off just jumping so you can do a normal into shadow wind kick for more damage!

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Yep, if you’re directly on top of him when it pops, you’re gonna eat it unless you jump. And simply jumping is most often going to be the best bet; some characters (Sadira for example) have some pretty great ways to punish it from the air.

Sandsplosion might be an exception… isn’t that like 2 frames?