3.4 Patch Notes

#82

Hmmm these bomb changes to ARIA. Yeah…can barely get the bombs to actually connect with eachother even without a combo.

@developers seems really weird. Alot of the bombs are whiffing even outside juggles. st/cl.hk bombs are whiffing alot. And not getting full damage each.

#83

This patch is a great example of why I love the IG/MS team - they’re thoughtful about balance in general, and they really do listen to (reasonable) fan feedback. And seriously, what other devs give their rationale behind changes the way they do on a consistent basis?

Some of my favorite changes:

  • Light Sammamish no longer has full body invulnerability. Their rationale given is exactly right.
  • Cyber Uppercut no longer auto corrects to face the opponent when you pip cancel into it from any other special move. I think this change is huge - it wasn’t pip cancel per se that had people salty about Fulgore, it was that he literally removed all escape options from a lot of characters. “Here, hold this plus on block special, and if you jump I’m going to DP you in the face for it.” Honorable mention to air laser height restriction.
  • Omen throw->ambiguous special nerf. Their rationale is again spot-on.
  • Reduced the damage of opener Shadow Fission by 45%. This was a personal request of mine, given how batshit-insane Cinder’s 3rd degree->shadow fission was. Consider me mollified on target combo->unbreakable shadow.
  • The bombs from Aria’s Standing HK, Standing Close HK, Crouching HK, and Jumping HK are now breakable and counter breakable. w00t! Aria’s grenade juggle vortex was just soul sucking to watch. She will still have a great vortex, but at least now she doesn’t get to repeatedly stack unbreakable projectile juggles into each rep.
  • Tusk’s Stagger Ender now adds 100 KV instead of 50 KV. You must use a Shadow move or throw if you wish to continue the combo, as any other hit will now blow out. One chance stagger->one chance->stagger->throw was pretty degenerate, and frustrating to deal with.
  • The window to fire a 2nd and 3rd shot after a jumping Carbine attack has been reduced from 22 frames to 5 frames. This means that Arbiter cannot wait for an extended period before firing again on the way down.
  • Fixed a bug causing the ender version of Gargos’ Izuna Drop to cause a hard knockdown. Honorable mention: minions stay down while Gargos is getting hit. I think both of these changes are good for the game. Make Gargos choose between damage and minions, and make minions a little less frustrating for people to deal with.
  • Basically all the Eyedol changes, but especially the (slightly) slower overhead and the continued reduction in jump+HP’s utility.

Raam’s changes are also good. It’s good that his kryll rush will be more useful against zoners.

All in all though, a very good suite of changes. I’d have liked to see a bit more damage from Sadira, and the nerf to Gargos’ zoning damage seems a bit much, but there really isn’t anything in here to truly complain about IMO. Again, fantastic job to the team, and thanks for all the hard work! :slight_smile::thumbsup:

2 Likes
#84

interesting changes here. Not going to lie, the Jago nerfs did hurt my soul a bit but after reading Infil’s post I guess I can understand.

For Kim Wu, I definitely can’t wait to try her again. Hopefully these changes really help her out.

The change to shadow eye laser I’m fine with. I like the change to the grounded version and it’s understandable why they gave a height limit to the air version from a DP. Personally I feel like it’s a better compromise than say removing it outright. There almost to no point wasting shadow on that move in neutral that the grounded version can’t do better.

#85

My thoughts on all:

Jago: Makes sense I guess, but honestly I think that his healing has always been more of an issue than his damage. Shouldn’t lower his overall damage that much though, since damage ender already isn’t his go-to outside of lockouts/CBs.

Wulf: I think a lot of people were expecting more but really it looks just about right to me. Wulf was already good.

Glacius: I don’t really care about his reversal options being tweaked, but I do think it’s curious that he remains the character with the worst shadow opener options in the game aside from eyedol mage.

Thunder: A home run. Exactly what needed to happen, he was going a bit too nuts. I do wonder if the damage nerfs are enough, but I’ll have to see it in action to know.

Sadira: Heeeeeeell yeah. Everything here is aces. Even though she’s technically not hitting harder she’ll still be getting more damage due to all these lovely ways she can make her combos less predictable~ However, I would still like to see a small buff to her shadow cashout, like wulf got.

Orchid: Not much to say.

Spinal: A very minor change, but I think one that’ll help him be just a bit harder to deal with once he’s on you.

Fulgore: Hmmmmmmmmm…I wonder where these ideas came from? :stuck_out_tongue: Really though, it’d be pretty silly if I said I didn’t like them considering they’re almost exactly the changes I said I wanted.

TJ: Seems fair to me. TJ can be quite scary already but now it’s a lot more threatening to get opened up as he gets a fat chunk of damage up front.

Maya: The dagger assault buff seems like it’s done while afraid to overbuff her, to be honest. Also no mention of a bugfix for heavy dagger toss, which as far as I’m aware is never supposed to be breakable but sometimes is anyway.

Kan-ra: Again, feels maybe like they’re afraid to overbuff him, but making shadow bugs more effective is a nice change.

Riptor: Subtle, but nice. She’s already good, this just seems like it’s meant to alleviate some frustrating stuff.

Omen: Pretty nice.

Aganos: Nice! I think that’s a really good way to give him just a little something more without overbuffing him.

Hisako: I agree with only bugfixes. She’s in a good spot.

Aria: Should bring her one-chance damage down just a bit, pretty sensible.

Shago: All bugfixes is fine, I don’t like him but I also don’t think he really has balance issues.

Kim: Daaaamn. Spicy stuff. Stronger mixups, stronger footsies, stronger defense, and that resource ender is a really fun idea.

Tusk: Lots of fun stuff but what I’m curious about is the stagger ender…he can’t manual a sweep after, correct? I feel like maybe he should get that if he’s losing the ability to continue the combo. Not sure though.

Rash: All makes sense, very glad sweep is a bit worse. His footsie game is still strong, just a little less dumb.

Arbiter: He’s going to be a much more interesting character after this patch, I think. If it’s less easy to just dump all your shots into someone in a combo he’ll likely be redirecting his resources into the other, much more interesting uses for shots. I’m actually pretty surprised his damage ender is still just as strong, though.

Mira: All good, though I’m very disappointed we never got to see someone use her setups with the airdash glitch in a tournament. :stuck_out_tongue:

Gargos: Oof! That’s a lot of stuff! Personally I agree with most of it but I’m very iffy on whether I’m down with that damage nerf; his ranged combos already did crap damage…

Eyedol: I honestly have no idea. There’s so many changes here I’ll have to get hands on to know what I think, but most of it seems pretty good. Though…I’m not sure about those overhead nerfs. Seems maybe excessive.

1 Like
#86

Spinal
Jumping MK (Divekick) now has 6 frames less landing recovery.
Jumping MK (Divekick) now deals 5 less frames of blockstun.

“Oh hell yeah!” - Stone Cold Steve Austin

1 Like
#87

Id be interested to hear some concrete things on why people dislike or like these Eyedol changes, overall I don’t think it actually changes things to terribly much, beyond a few very specific things. The way a lot of people react you’d think the devil had been banished back to hell and everyone had been saved from 1000 years of plague.

#88

I just want everyone to know for the record that I had no prior knowledge days/weeks about any of these changes going into the stream today and hopefully @rukizzel can back me up on this. Also I did my best to try and demonstrate the changes for the characters we showed but I don’t play half of them haha.

When I saw them though before the stream I was happy with them, lets hope everyone else likes them as well.

5 Likes
#89

Nah, those feel about right to me. Playing Hisako makes me sensitive to how fast moves in neutral are, and his overhead was really bloody fast for its effective range. Warrior Eyedol is a very potent footsie character anyway (long pokes, good dash, and plus on block buttons), so having a near half-screen overhead that was as fast and as safe as it was seemed a bit much in my opinion.

#90

Lel no. Non ender versino still works fine :smiley: Stagger and wallsplat thug life. Is the shadow ender version still a hard knock down?

#91

being fast and safe may have been a bit much but now its -4 so changing the speed was maybe unnecessary? hard to say. Also Hisako almost has the reverse overhead in her sweep. The difference is she doesn’t get to combo out of it but they are different characters in more ways than that anyway.

#92

I agree it was too good, I just think it feels a bit excessive to be slow AND less safe AND lose the low invul, all at once.

1 Like
#93

It’s now basically as fast as shatter, is safe on block at -4 (good luck challenging it from range, and Eyedol has excellent followup buttons, like cr.MP, that are fast and outrange you), and it recaptures you if you randomly jump. If you block overhead preemptively because you’re scared of Eyedol’s rushdown, he gets to do run in cr.MK for a low, or run in cr.MP for advantage.

You’ll be able to block it on reaction a bit more but I don’t think a) people will always block it, and b) that was really the point of the move.

1 Like
#94

I think it’s less of a problem in neutral. If you get tagged by a neutral command grab, then you’ve been called out to a certain extent and maybe a little extra punishment is in order. :-p

I’m about 97% certain that the move is still mostly unpunishable - it hits from so far away that there are very few things that reach far enough fast enough to actually punish Eyedol for throwing it out. The “on block” nerf just makes it a little more obvious that it is no longer Eyedol’s turn if you block his overhead; before he sometimes got to just push another long poke button and just keep applying pressure. He still might be able to do that actually - Eyedol’s got good ranged buttons that come out pretty fast.

With regards to its “similarity” to Hisako sweep, I’d say the lack of a combo is a pretty significant difference, enough of one that I actually wouldn’t consider the moves all that similar. Opinions may vary on that I suppose.

#95

I don’t think too many people would be upset at you for not doing proper combos for Sadira or something (those will take even Sadira mains time to figure out). I found it a little odd you weren’t able to show the Gargos minion change just by summoning a minion, waiting until he attacks (and blocking it), then doing a shadow to start a combo + knock the minion down, but oh well.

I was really hoping for most of the stream that you would jump in and give more insight into how these changes will affect high level play, though. Most of the time you were kind of just sitting there, messing around in training or waiting for James to finish shuffling the pages in front of him. I think there was a really good opportunity for you to take charge and talk about why high level KI is going to be better (or worse!) with each change, so I was a little sad that didn’t happen. That was why they brought you on, after all, since you have insight into the high level scene. Just some advice in case you get to do it again in the future.

3 Likes
#96

Or I can wall splat into command grab for free minion. Manual standing heavy punch into command grab for minion. Basically Gargos nerfs don’t mean a thing :smiling_imp:

1 Like
#97

Lol. Don’t gloat too much - it’s entirely possible the HKD off “neutral” command grab damage ender was just an oversight, and that it will be corrected in the future.

1 Like
#98

The game updated to 3.4 on Windows 10, the game crashes to desktop after a few Shadow Lord missions. Happened 4 times already

#99

Holy cow this makes Gargos tied for most (possible) skins along with Shadow Jago at twelve, now.

Orchid too, if you count her unreleased Ultimate Source skin that I’d really like to see teased sometime hint hint.
EDIT: Oh and Jago when the soundlink figure launches.

#100

Everyone talking about Shadow Lords and Mimic skins. But they forget about one more thing…

WHEN’S SHAGO AND OMEN’S NEW ACCESSORIES AND COLORS?

13 Likes
#101

Oh yeah! I remember they mentioned that.

With the Eyedol unlock for Shadow Lords I’d assume.

2 Likes