Shadow Lords TOO HARD!

The shadow lords item combo’d with odorous wolf heart should be super easy. Shadow lord gives unimaginable buffs to you, with unblockable attacks you should do half a life bar with a 1 chance break

You cant prioritize buffs of Gargos. I beat all 4 that were given. When he lands he brings a buff with him that you cant debuff. My luck has been both times it was Fang

Yeah I’ve done several run throughs now and still can’t beat Gargos. Last time I used Jago with epic fractured ward, +25/+25, wolf heart, Mira with killer snake, +25/+25, rat brain and Glacius with the same loadout Jago had. After he resurrected twice, I lost.

Look, I get how this mode has to be balanced and I’m glad that it makes the guardians and consumables and other items that much more useful, but I honestly think that the difficulty on challenging needs some tweaking, because right now it’s frustratingly punishing and I’m not just talking about Gargos.

Don’t get me wrong, I don’t mind losing (that much), but people need to keep in mind the fact that this mode is primarily single player (with a multiplayer component) and it also contains the story; two things that tend to be geared more toward casual players so a git gud response doesn’t really apply to a substantial portion of this audience, as you’ll have a lot of people with middling skill level for a variety of reasons.

Now that’s not to say that the mode has to be tilted toward the worst players and anyone with both a decent to good skill level plus a preference for single player / lore / accessory content can take a hike. That’s NOT what I’m saying.

But I do think that if you’re going to put something as desirable as a stage as the reward, which I think is a GREAT reward for this mode, that you should consider one of two things and I think you know what I’m going to say.

Either make the stage unlockable on Normal or adjust the difficulty down on Challenging. Otherwise, you’ll have a lot of casual players going through this mode a few times (or less out of frustration), playing on a difficulty they likely can’t handle to get the big reward getting a very bad taste in their mouth.

Godlike should stay as it is, or they could make it harder if it’s requested for all I care, as I’m not touching this difficulty even with its superior payouts. But effectively shutting people out of a good reward… I just don’t know if that’s going to motivate people to play more and earn better load outs if they still won’t help or if it’s something that could turn them away. If it’s even a question, I mean, is it really worth the risk?

I’m not looking for a free ride, or to have anything handed to me. I honestly love this mode and think it’s one of the best single player FG modes I’ve ever seen and I’m personally motivated to keep playing until I win. I love unlocking more and more content, making choices and the whole thing is just plain fun, but that’s me. For others out there with even less skill than me (if that’s even possible lol), I still can’t help but think that this type of mode with this particular reward could stand to be balanced a bit more at least made more attainable to those with a more casual skill level.

Just my 2 cents.

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I’m not going to say that it is easy, but I think that with right characters and loadouts anyone can beat Gargos on challenging. If you are just going after the stage, try and use…

##Omen:

  • Odorous Wolf Heart
  • +25 dam/def
  • Killer/Epic Ram
  • full instinct/shadow meter

##Fulgore:

  • Odorous Wolf Heart
  • +25 dam/def
  • Killer/Epic Ram
  • Ceremonial Dagger
  • full instinct/shadow meter

##(whoever your best character is)

  • Odorous Wolf Heart
  • +25 dam/def
  • Killer/Epic Guardian
  • full instinct/shadow meter

The strategy is with Omen is to ONLY try and hit the demonic despair and cash out the damage. More than likely you’ll be able to hit it at least once, and as long as you get just one, you should be good.

Next with Fulgore, ONLY focus on hitting the devastation beam. With this set up, a hype-beam does 50% easy of real damage, and by just spamming it, you will destroy him. That being said, Boss Gargos has many ways to get in, so none of this is 100% guaranteed/easy. You are still going to have to react to what he does, block his teleports, and choose your shots wisely.

Finally, if Gargos has survived all this, THEN you play the game. Choose whatever character, with whatever load out fits your play-style, and you should be able to pull out the win. With the Wulf Heart, activate it right at the start and just go in. Taking Gargos down one life bar into Ultra is doable for sure.

If you want to make this battle even easier, equip a shadow lord item to your characters, and you should be pretty OP going into this fight.

I’ve fought Gargos on Challenging a few times, but only two times of note: one time with this load-out minus the shadow lord items and strategy, and then a second time with the shadow lord item and the strategy. The first time without the SL item, I lost in a nail biter with Fulgore as my lead, Sabrewulf next, and Omen as my anchor. Fulgore worked like a charm, but Wulf failed miserably, and I never went for a DD with Omen at all. It was a close and frustrating battle, but it was a learning experience for sure.

The second time I fought him I supremed him with Omen because I hit the DD twice and cashed it out both times. Trust me man, you can do this, just find the find strat that works for you, execute, and you can take him down.

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What does the Shadow Lord item do?

From what I can tell, it just massively buffs your damage, and maybe defense. People have been reporting that it can make one-chance-breaks do like 50%. There is not official word that I know of that outlines what it does.

I have a friend I talk to on skype often. He only owns Nintendo consoles and the only fighting games he plays are Smash and Pokken. He is decent at both games but only plays at a casual level.

About a month or two ago he managed to download KI on his Windows laptop. It doesn’t run well and he is unable to play online, so he only plays offline every once in a while with the current free characters.

He has recently began playing Shadow Lords. Keep in mind that he has no KI gold to pay for packs, and he can only be sure to have Jago each run. He has to rely on weekly rotation and recruit missions to fill up his other 2 team members.

And he has already beaten Gargos on Challenging 3 times within the span of a day.

Anybody can beat Gargos.

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Yesterday I told a friend that this time Gargos beated me on Godlike but if I got VERY CLOSE to defeat him on that mode, anybody (with a careful plan on any difficulty) can do it, the first thing is to get used of how Boss Gargos plays and of course destroy the 4 Omens, the main thing is not getting discouraged of failing the fights, eventually you can outsmart the CPU (and learn a thing or two of your characters in the process) and win Shadow Lords. My keywords are: HAVE FUN AND BE PATIENT.

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This is kind of amazing to me. They should allow you to only choose a single captain and then recruit as you play. That would give the game another twist.

In fact, I never even tried to see if this is a possibility. Can you do this if you have the entire game?

Hopefully they can update the game to replace the locked random option as an end button or add that option (like Capcom VS Snk 2 on ratio mode when you can decide to have just a single character or two, rather than being forced to have the 3 characters on your team), it would give an interesting twist for players that own every character or most of them.

You do realize that this one person you’re talking about doesn’t actually represent the whole of casual fighting game fans or their skills, right? It’s also just a tad bit condescending to come in here and have to humble yourself a bit and admit that something’s a bit harder than you’d like it to be, only to have someone else come in and basically say “yeah my friend that barely plays fighting games? Yeah he beat this, so anyone should be able to.” The implication behind that statement to anyone that’s found the mode to be a bit on the punishing side being pretty obvious here.

What exactly is your motivation here? I’m curious. Don’t get me wrong, like I said, I plan to keep trying and I do enjoy this mode immensely. But your example aside, I’m trying to look at a bigger picture outside of myself and my fandom, as I’ve seen a bit more evidence (though it’s admittedly still anecdotal) from people that this mode can be a bit too punishing.

Again, not saying that the mode should be a cake walk, as that defeats the need for all of the consumables and guardians etc in the first place, but for people that want the stage, there could be some unwanted frustration over something that’s meant to be fun. I think that this could be remedied a bit by allowing people playing on normal to unlock the stage.

Thanks!! I’ll give this method a try. I still want to beat him with a group of characters that I enjoy using on a regular basis, but I get what you’re driving at here and I think it makes sense. I wish that I were good enough to beat him with a little less velveeta, but maybe that’s not the point?

To try and get people to understand that Challenging difficulty isn’t so hard that only pro players can do it, that you don’t need microtransactions or even your characters of choice.

I don’t see any reason why the devs should give the stage to people on a lower difficulty so that they can play the mode as little as possible. I understand that @MudArcade has already stated that he does enjoy the mode. That’s good, and I have faith he’ll eventually be able to beat it on Challenging as it is right now.

I only stand by my points because I see what I want from this mode and how I think it will be fun. I guess making the stage unlockable on Normal won’t really affect me. But lowering the difficulty on Challenging would make the mode boring, because it lowers the risk of all my decisions. Am I selfish in this thought? Probably. But that’s what I think.

When the devs revealed this mode, they said something along the lines of “Be prepared to lose a lot. Once you accept that you will lose, you will be in the right mindset to work towards beating the mode.” I think some players are not at this point yet.

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Isn’t so hard… For you. Again, this mode tends to be geared more toward casual players by its very nature. Can we agree on that? I’m not saying they’re the only people that play the mode. Godlike difficulty undoubtedly exists for this very reason.

But I just think that there’s a chance that, more likely than not, there will be players with mediocre skills, but the desire to unlock everything. You can’t just say “git gud” to these people or “anyone can do it.” They’ll just go find something else to play instead.

There are obviously a ton of players out there that don’t come to this site, that have no idea what the best load out is to cheese Gargos for a win, who will play a few times and be disgusted with the difficulty and quit and that’s even assuming they know the whole purpose of the mode and the fact that you’re not supposed to be able to beat it the first few times going through.

So you think it would be better to force people in to a situation where they become frustrated and want to quit the entire game because the content they want to see is locked behind something that makes them angry?

Look, I get it, games are too easy these days and players should want to be better and learn and play harder, etc. But that’s not the entire audience of a game. It’s just not. Some play for the challenge, no question, and of course you can’t make the game geared toward the worst players at the expense of the decent or better players, but there could be a better balance, that’s all I’m saying.

Yeah okay, I’m trying to think of other people and how other casuals might perceive the mode. As far as I’m personally concerned? I’m enjoying the grind.

I think you’re right about adjusting the difficulty on Challenging. There has to be a middle ground between Godlike and Normal that’s stiff enough to force you to upgrade, but not with the kind of difficulty that Godlike offers.

I think the stage unlocking on normal would be good for people that are more content oriented and are interested less in the grind, in losing a lot, etc. To me, it’s better to cast as wide a net as possible and keep more people happy. I mean, I’m sure most casuals would enjoy the mode and playing against opponents and unlocking mimic skins and what not. I don’t think it just has to be about the stage and then that’s it.

That’s certainly true, but I also think that there’s probably a decent number of players that either A. hate losing by its very nature and B don’t follow what the devs do or say and maybe have no idea why this mode is so punishing beyond the idea that it’s steering you toward unlock items/guardians or, on a more sinister level, perhaps steering you toward microtransactions.

Now, I agree with you that you absolutely do NOT need those to beat this mode. But I think it’s entirely possible for some people to play this mode, get to Gargos, get thoroughly destroyed and come away with the assumption that the only way to beat it is to spend real money.

The more they can do to mitigate that possibility, the better.

It just takes patience and time.

I have yet to actually just play on Challenging, and wade through all the battles to get Gargos’ buffs off. In order to do that, I would have to pick the characters I know best, and at this point I’m just having fun playing in Normal, picking whatever character team, and just trying to amass a ton of items, all the lore, and have fun. Maybe once I unlock all the dossiers, get some more mimic skins, and reach a level of understanding of the game with a few more characters to where I feel comfortable, I will then jump into Challenging for real, but right now I’m just not there.

For the record though, Boss Gargos is nothing but cheese…but I get you. I too have my preferred characters and will try to beat him with them, but at the same time I know that in order to get everything I want in SLs, I’m going to have to play with everybody to a degree. I see/saw the Stage as just one of those things. Maybe after I unlock everything (or maybe just some more stuff) I will go back in and try and push through a challenging or Godlike run, but right now I need to get my skills up a bit more before I start banging my head against that wall (lol).

FYI: When I beat challenging Gargos, I just skipped right to him and fought him with all buffs. That Gargos isn’t meant to be far, so I have no regret about doing what I did. I did that Challenging run after playing on Normal and beating that mode at least like 10 times, so I had a ton of items to burn, and just wanted to see if I could do it. This is also after trying to play a legit Challenging run…which just wasn’t fun as I was burning through resources like nobodies business.

At the end of the day though, you can do it. Again, just find your strat, and execute.

I find the one try gargos very off putting. All that work for one shot. I’ve barely touched the game in weeks because of this and a few other issues I have with it.

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All of this here makes perfect sense to me, and it’s really how I should’ve gone in at the start. I figured “I’ll get the stage first, get that over with, and then move down to normal so I can really enjoy playing the matches, making the decisions, unlocking the skins, the lore parts, etc.” Probably not the best path I could’ve chosen lol.

You’re also right on the cheese part with Gargos. I guess I was hoping that some modicum of skill would get me passed him once I had enough in terms of guardians and consumables, but trying to beat him in a straight up match doesn’t seem to be doing me much good.

Absolutely.

I’m pretty sure the game straight up tells you “Don’t be afraid to lose!” after you complete the tutorial segment.

Though TBH not many people read those anyway :unamused:

Many other games have done this. Remember Mileena skin #3 in MK9? That was fun, right?

Is this a good design idea? I guess that’s up to interpretation.

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Thats what they do man, they come in and try to make you look bad by being condescending. Its on nearly every thread. Especially if they dont agree with your opinion. there is a hand full of regulars that do this. I just ignore them.

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Git gud
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KAPPA

I’ll put this out there for everyone, Shadow Lords, much like old boss Shadow Jago, doesn’t require skill to beat, at least not a lot. Have you ever lost an online match to a Jago that just kept jumping Mk because your game was off? Sure… We all have. The thing with shadow lords, you’re chances of winning come from your preparations. Play normal, get guardians, consumables, artifacts, stockpile resources to make your team op. I played normal 5 times before I tried challenging. I wanted a snake guardian since it was key to my strategy along with odorous wolf hearts. I farmed until I got them and beat challenging my first go. It was no cake walk, it took all 3 characters to win, but I did. Unblockable attacks, 1 chance break into poison ender. Always attack him, don’t let him instinct or summon minions. That is what I used. I know there are other strategies, like flip out spam, or meaty throw spam, find what works for you and have patience. The mode is hard, so it feels rewarding when you win. If everyone could dominate shadow lords day one and earn all the skins, what would be the purpose? Why are games like Contra, Mega Man and Castlevania still soo popular when they were punishingly difficult? No game is for everyone, but there are difficulty levels for everyone. If challenging is too hard, better prepare for the next time. You will unlock everything eventually.

Anyone that wants help developing strategies can talk to me. I can even give some tips on how to get items and ways to setup teams.

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