My Personal Take On Arbiter in 3.7

This is just a personal little rant here, and if anyone wants to discuss with me (preferably politely) that’d be awesome.

Before Arbiter got nerf hammers, I thought he was one of the more overrated characters in the cast. He had a lot of really stupid stuff back then, like high damage one chances and gun loops and the like. But whenever I played him back then, I rarely used those tools. And I struggled. A lot.

Arbiter’s offense, from my perspective, seems quite linear. His mixup game is limited, having a good overhead selection, but also situational low and a command grab that is relatively easier to react to than most of the cast. His buttons in a small range (just outside of his light buttons) where many fast characters and rushdown characters liked to hang out was a pain, because the buttons he has at that range are slightly slower than a majority of the cast as well. When I fought Arbiter, once I learned how to just wait it out, his offense became something more like Cinder’s: not terrible, but not stellar either.

His defense was the main thing that frustrated me, though. His two reversals are arguably the worst reversals in the entire game (barring heavy reckoning from Gargos obviously); both costing resources, doing low/zero damage and being somewhat easy to bait. And they’ve only gotten worse since then, with overshield becoming more negative and his grenades being situationally worse/better. His anti-air options, while they seem good frame data and hitbox wise, are not very good once you take into account the size of Arbiter himself. I often find I’m too slow to punish jump ins and end up getting kicked in the face; sure that’s my fault, but I rarely have this much trouble anti-airing with any other character.

Now, I’m not saying Arbiter is unviable now. Were the nerfs needed? Yes. Did I like them? Yes. And as I play this character more I’m starting to understand how the developers wanted him to be played. He’s supposed to sit at midrange and poke at his opponent with his high range normals in order to stall time for his resources to build. And I like that playstyle and how it forces me to be patient.

But regardless, Arbiter feels so limited to me. It honestly feels like midrange poking is the only thing he’s really good at. His damage is bad unless you get higher ender levels (which he has trouble building usually), his vortex game is quite overrated in my opinion and his defense, like I said, is just terrible. And while his poking normals are good, all it takes is one whiff and the faster characters can get into a space that Arbiter struggles to fight in.

I’m never going to say a character is bad in this game, because I know there may be a lot that I’m missing. But I just feel like Arbiter struggles a bit too much in too many areas because of how limited he feels. I simply cannot see this character being any higher than low tier because of how hard he gets dunked by some characters.

These are just a few suggestions and ideas for how to make him a bit more varied and fun, and to help him deal with his harder matchups:

-Turn one of his enders into a low damage resource ender. His ender options are all very similar with nearly negligible reasons to use one over the other. I think it would be cool to see an ender that restores his shield.

-Increase the allowed time window between sword target combos. This could help Arbiter keep an opponent at bay as well as add to his ranged offense.

-Slightly increase the speed of cr.MK so he can more easily challenge buttons at that range while still not get much reward from it.

-Have Shadow Prophet’s Bane deal a bit of potential damage and recover faster on whiff. Could be just me, but I cannot find a practical use for this move with its current reward other than finishing a round.

-Allow Shadow Truth Seeker to recapture/stagger. This move is tough to land, both in juggles and in neutral, and I think the reward should match it. It could also make for some fun combos.

-Change the inputs of the carbine bash normals to back+HK instead of forward+HK. This current input adds an extra risk to trying to anti-air that I feel is unnecessary irritation.

-This is a fun, crazy idea that will probably never happen, but I think it would be fun to let Arbiter shoot his own grenade with a carbine bullet to explode it manually.

Maybe I’m just a crazy person and Arbiter is secretly top tier. But I figured I’d have fun making some suggestions for a character I really want to get good with. Thanks for reading :slight_smile:

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I think my favorite change idea would be to allow his Shadow Command Grab to cash out combos as a big ender like the other CG’s in the game. Give him something else to use meter on besides shield.

Give him parry out of instinct

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This sounds incredibly dangerous, lol

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Sure hisako has an easier parry , kim too

Way different though, both of those are openers and both of those have actual whiff recovery, Arbiter’s parry has almost no whiff recovery and you get a normal xx shadow punish if you want it. Hisako has to guess between high/low, and Kim’s doesn’t lead to a combo without a resource and also does no damage.

If they altered it in some way , think it could be a nice edition to his arsenal

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Lol. I think you’re just mad you went 9-1 against my Glacius instead of 10-0…

It’s tough for me to participate in these discussions because I don’t fight top tier opponents very often. I think you should keep in mind that he does have those ranged pokes and he does have some nasty setups. His biggest problem was and will continue to be that he engages from mid range without any low attack. So blocking high can prevent most of his offense. But as you say, this lets him poke and stall until he has resources to open you up.

I think another big weakness is that some characters can deal really easily with his grenades (Glacius is one - I can play more or less without worrying all that much about it), and this takes away one of his most valuable opening tools.

Having said that, his shield is a pretty amazing resource and I’m not sure he needs more of it. More to the point, giving him more resources to use for shield doesn’t make him less linear or give him more options, it just makes him harder to kill.

I do like the idea of letting him shoot his grenades. This would let him spend his finite bullets to create some grenade mixup situations. It would have to be done well, but I think it could make him more interesting for sure.

Edit: tagging @KevBones10 because he plays Arbiter well.

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IMO Arbiter is fine. The thing is that, in a game full of characters who “play in a very unique way”, Arbiter is one of the most… “unfitting” to KI mechanics. How so?

-In a game full of crazy offensive characters, Arby is more suited to control the neutral and slow the fight’s pace

-He is(potentially), the character with more health of the game. Only Aria, Kim and characters with armor can increase their durability. And Arbiter is the one who gets more easily extra life.

-He has a resource which can’t recover, his ammo, only Aria shares this trait, and her resource is linked to her health

-He has good damage in low level enders, encouraging one chancers. Combined with his neutral tools (good range in normals, a supressive tool which makes him fearsome, super good projectile, more health…), this makes Arby a character who has to do more openings than other chars to make damage, but also makes him more durable

My opinion on Arby is that he is not being used as he should. IMO grenades are useful and flashy for combos, but I believe that this is a waste of resources unless it’s used for killing(ending a round). I believe that Arby should be using his nades to mantain in check his opponents, sticking one in neutral(after a blocked normal, for example), getting closer as the nade becomes active, and mixing then overhead and low-launcher. All while shielded to cover himself from the nade.
Arby works in bursts of offense when he has shields and nades to put fear in his opponent. And although he has below average damage and has to open his opponent more to win, he also has potential to have more health and so he has to be opened more. Considering this, boosting his damage sounds dangerous to me.

Arby has a surprisingly good meter gain. And I believe people are to afraid to use raw shield. Are you fullscreen and meter is available? Shield up! Suddenly, Fulgore, Glacius, Mira, Aria or Spinal have to deal with your shield before using their projectile mixups.

His bad antiairs are that bad? If anybody jumps, j.mp covers a lot of space, so he has to react air approaches with jumps. Also, while shielded, nade detonation works well for this. They are not top class, but is an intended flaw in his toolset, andI don’t believe he is abusable in this area.

Overall, Arby needs more patient approaches, conservative spacing, good reactions and good resource management. I believe he is in a good spot, but a lot of people insists to use him as rushdown instead of control

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The problem that Arbiter suffers from in neutral is that all his moves must be used in anticipation, because if he throws anything out and misses, or tries to interrupt a player’s movement on reaction, he can be punished and now he has to deal with whatever vortex the opponent has. He’s not hopeless when dealing with pressure, but he’s far from good at it. And applying a grenade only helps somewhat.

I don’t need you all to agree with me, but I think you would see what I mean if you tried playing him against characters like Wulf, Raam and even someone like Spinal.

not sure what to say i think arbiter is fine and since i saw the set between nate and truth arbiter still looks strong some people say that arbiter is no longer brain dead… i only thought that arbiters damage before was the brain dead thing but hey what do i know i think arbiter can do decent in tourneys like kev did in world cup its hard to explain by typing but thats just me lol @SonicDolphin117

Not anymore.

That’s pretty much my take on that “shield ender” idea. You wouldn’t substantially change the character, just make it so that it now takes X+1 openings to kill him instead of X.

As a note, I think @KevBones10 plays Arbiter most closely to how he should be played. I view Arby as a mid-range space control character only to the extent that he needs to be to land that confirmable hit, and after that he’s vortex. Up close and with shield cancels he gets to make you guess between meaty normal/command grab, and if he has a grenade on you (which is likely), either option leads to combo. I think the character can be quite strong; he can certainly find himself in bad spots if he doesn’t manage his resources/shield properly, but that’s part of playing him well I think.

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Eh, my main point was just make his enders more varied and give him a reason to use them more.

Gonna have to disagree with you on that one. But of course I could be wrong.

Fair enough. Reasonable people can disagree :slight_smile:

[quote=“Dayv0, post:9, topic:20760”]
My opinion on Arby is that he is not being used as he should.[/quote]
THIS, this this. ^^^^^^^

[quote=“Dayv0, post:9, topic:20760”]IMO grenades are useful and flashy for combos, but I believe that this is a waste of resources unless it’s used for killing(ending a round). I believe that Arby should be using his nades to mantain in check his opponents, sticking one in neutral(after a blocked normal, for example), getting closer as the nade becomes active, and mixing then overhead and low-launcher. All while shielded to cover himself from the nade.
Arby works in bursts of offense when he has shields and nades to put fear in his opponent. And although he has below average damage and has to open his opponent more to win, he also has potential to have more health and so he has to be opened more.[/quote]

i’ve said this in other threads before, but i really think people are seriously underestimating this character’s potential to win games. maybe it’s not through “flashy” and fancy mix-ups, but let me tell you once Arbiter turns into the Neutral Wall, it is a trial. i’ve gotten blown up by Arbiters far more than Fulgores.

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Just be honest with yourself and stop constantly reiterating that you don’t think he’s weak or lacklustre.

sorry for wanting to have a conversation with other people where we share our experiences and perspectives on the topic at hand, i guess? :\

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He’s free to share his opinion. I believe he means what he says. Cut it out.

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Yeah, don’t apologize for that :thumbsup: