Light emergence: Is it usefull? Does it need tweaking?

#1

This is a move that is low invulnerable during active frames, puts a swarm on the opponent, and is wildly unsafe on block. Because the invulnerability frames don’t apply until the active frames, it can get beat out pretty easily. This move in it’s current state doesn’t feel useful and I feel it could use some MINOR tweaks. If the low invulnerability frames were perhaps put on start-up that would help. Another option would be to make light emergence actually hit low. This may prove a little too powerful though, so I imagine this would not happen.

Bottom line, this move seems to have a little too much risk relative to its reward and I feel that it needs to change ever so slightly. Does anyone else have any ideas to make this move more useful without making it broken?

#2

I agree about the idea of making it invul to lows during startup

Making it a low does’t matter: Since Raam lacks grounded overheads, you should never stand block him. Crouch blocking is enough to block any of his grounded attacks, and then stand block should be used only for aerial attacs.

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#3

Well, according to the command list, it is invulnerable to lows on startup, but it seems like there may be one or two frames where that doesn’t seem exactly true.

Using the hitboxes on the training mode, the move seems like instant invulnerable to lows. The high version definitely feels and looks like it, but the low version feels deceptively off by maybe a frame or two, but within a margin too narrow to confirm visually.

I have the ability to capture 60 fps footage with an Elgato, but I don’t have any video software to playback and analyze 60 fps footage on a frame by frame basis, otherwise I would test the startup sequence myself.

However, in training mode, I can get Fulgore to sweep me constantly on recording, and when I go to use it, I can get the reversal indicator to pop up on timing, but Fulgore still beats it every time. It seems there is a frame or two by which there is no invulnerability on startup, which makes the description misleading, and possibly the move not working as intended.

Then again, those frames may be in there by design, but I don’t see the reason to it.

Thinking about it, on my road to getting RAAM to level 50, this is a move I rarely utilitzed at all. The Anti-Air, upper body emergence and the full body version were much more reliable, but lower body does seem to be beaten out too easily.

Side Note: The buff to the Kryll Shield cancel sounds awesome, I think it’ll be much more useful now. However, according to the command list, it still mentions 1 bar as the cost, when it should be have a shadow meter.

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#4

Low invuln on startup. If it’s too glorious, don’t let him FADC reversals. Baboom. RAAM perfected.

#5

How about making it an otg that applies kryll but leaves raam negative and is still breakable with lights. Idk if that sounds too good since you’d be able to just tack kryll on after damage.

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#6

I think the low invulnerability is there so the move emulates a special in terms of priority. As emergence is a projectile hitbox it won’t interact with other hitboxes for resolving trades, and rather than one move outprioritising the other you’d get a trade each time AFAIK. By removing the hurtbox underneath the emergence hitbox you remove the possibility it can trade with an attack covering this area.

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#7

I’m fairly certain he can’t do this currently. I don’t know for certain but I’ve never seen him FADC his heavy emergence.

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#8

I’ve never tried. If he can’t, then let’em have the bloody lower invuln, eh!? XD

#9

isn’t it low invuln on startup? It beats meaty jago cl mk

#10

That is a negative, meaty lows win against it.

#11

I personally think it should be low invincible from frame 1 and be safe on block to be useful.

#12

Yes.

No.

Any move that provides invincibility needs to be punishable or managable in some way. Most moves that have invincibility, especially on startup, have some sort of recovery to keep it from being OP. Even if it’s only partial invulnerability, it needs to be weighed and balanced to be fair.

Thunder’s Ankle Slicer may be fast and low invulnerable, but it generally has a longer startup as you use higher strength version, and the fastest version has little range, but is still negative on block to end block strings, adding an interrupt point to allow a knowledgeable opponent to overturn pressure.

If light emergence gets low invincibility on from the moment it starts, it needs to be punishable, there should be nothing that fast, protective with partial invulnerability, and should be safe on block. Otherwise, it becomes a spammable, thoughtless move.

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#13

oh it got broken this patch. it was low invuln on startup before hand

#14

not just this patch. Even when RAAM premiered meaty lows could beat it.

#15

no it got fixed at one point, then it rebroke again i guess

#16

my bad, did not know this. I guess I’m off to the bug reporting thread.

#17

It was not low invul from startup in the previous patch

#18

I never had an use for this move because all this.

#19

I’m not sure if what has been said here is justification for change but I might as well tag @TheKeits . If nothing else he can explain to us how the move is meant to be used. Not trying to be a smart alack, just acknowledging that I don’t know the devs intentions.

#20

I watched the gameplay walkthrough again to see what keits said about it then and it is supposed to be fully lower body invincible, keits even tried to show that it was but got hit out of it and simply moved on. I guess it’s just something small that they keep forgetting to fix.