Imagine a system in KI that only granted you 10-12 breaks per round, & you had to use them wisely whille actually knowing how to break. This would be so interesting.
Would this stop people from guess breaking every time they got touched, being risky, or getting potentially rewarded off of 1 frame breaks? Probably not, but it would reward those who have done their due diligence in combo breaker training that deserve the punish for having the read. I’ve found myself losing to scrubs in ranked that don’t really win against me offensively, but just managed to guess break everything I do, even when I get the punish. This is insanely annoying and peeves me a great deal. Will it change? Probably not. Does it need to change? Nope. I just think it would be nice for skill to set precedence over luck more often than not. Since there seems to be so many new guesstimation situational mechanics in S3, I think it’d be wonderful to see an interesting balance like this.
Imagine that… You only get 10-12 breaks per round. You have to use them wisely… & since you can run out of them they have to actually KNOW how to break and react to visual/audio cues. Gosh… Only in my dreams.
I would disagree. It’s hard enough to do a combo breaker as it is. Not only know the proper command, bit being to read the opponent to select the right command, and timing it properly. Part of the challenge is honing your combo breaking skill in full fledged combat, because I find that the dojo is insufficient after a while, lacking in the randomization that a human adversary has.
IMO, the breaker system is perfect right now and they did an amazing job at reworking the old mechanic to make it a new, more interesting one. I say don’t fix what aint broken in this case. Expecting the audience to be able to accurately read breakers 100% of the time would certainly deter new players from sticking with the game long enough to figure it out.
On the contrary, you’re supposed to read the oppositions offensiveness 100% of the time. That’s the goal. The issue is that the expectation is not there. Why pay attention to visual cues when you can guess break, right?
So…having a limited number of breakers is better for the game then it is right now? And you believe that that’s better then what we have now?
Counter-breakers…linkers, getting reads, not being predictable etc etc. It’s all there…been there since the beginning. If you’re getting guess broken on everything with little success you might want to improve your neutral game then and/or your combo game.
And when you say noobs what exactly are you implying here? Total noobies, average players, top players dumb players? etc etc.
Plus it sounds like you overestimate yourself and/or get frustrated easily with guess-breaking and/or other things as well.
Also, if you get guess broken more times then not then how would this change affect you? You’re still going to be guess broken just as much as would know only difference is there’s a limit per round.
Here is, IMO, the absolute best strategy in a system that limits the number of breaks you can do:
Every single hit I get, I will do nothing but heavy auto-doubles and light linkers (or whatever my damage loop is). I will force you to spend your breaks while still doing pretty decent damage.
Then, when your breaks are over, I will kill you in one opening.
I will never change or diversify my combo. You will never have to guess break (because I will never give you something to guess break). Maybe some random times I will counter break just to expedite the process of killing you, but I don’t think I really have to do that if I have good neutral.
If you set the number of potential combo breaks low (ie, something like 5), then this strategy is provably best. If you set the number of potential combo breaks really high, to try and dodge this strategy (something like 20 or whatever), then it might as well functionally not exist, because nobody will run out of breaks.
The answer to avoiding guess breaking is already in the game; manuals, resets, delayed linkers/doubles, unpredictable combo strings, varying the length of your combo between one chance and max KV, making sure you capitalize on every lockout, and counter breakers. This is a pretty long list.
Adding a limit to breakers makes the game functionally degenerate, because either there is a provably best strategy, or the system allows so many breakers that the limit never comes into play.
I feel like this is a contradictory statement. How does guessing and improvement in ones neutral game go hand in hand?
The explanation implies only what the description of the opposition is. In this case, the break happy maniacs in ranked.
No, just guess breaking, & having to rinse & repeat back to back without getting rewarded for my reads in the neutral game. Getting broken 4 times in a row is on the 1st frame is too much especially when I’m mixing it up. In his mind he’s like “eh… I’ll press heavy here, lights this time, Oh I haven’t tried mediums yet, I’ll press it now!”… Then there’s me getting punished for throwing out a counter-breaker that didn’t work because the opposition guessed too early & got a time lockout & can now punish.
Fun should be the name of the game, not annoyance. To be honest not having fun is the only thing that affects me. Of course I’d still get guess broken just as much, but every guess is not correct. They’re 50/50 as well know. The limitation would implement the deserved reward, while also inducing that people actually learn the fundamentals of the game.
Ah wth, I’ll just keep my combos short and continue to go for set ups off of hard knock downs. Thats how I deal with the “Omg he opened me up I need to press a button NOW” players. One chance to set ups. Really no point in doing long combos in this game in most matches online (unless the opposition gets a lockout of course.)
I can appreciate the tid bit. The answers are certainly in the game. They are not effective as one would hope though. A lot of the time, guessing sets precedence over offensive skill.
I actually think this is the worst possible way to deal with guess breakers. You are maximizing their chances of guessing, while minimizing your rewards for when they guess incorrectly. It also really heightens the frustration of getting guess broken.
I would encourage you to rethink your strategy a bit. Long combos to give yourself maximum lockout punishment is absolutely necessary to deal with guess breaking. Ending the combo right after they lockout isn’t going to help you overcome guessing, and if I am a smart opponent and I realize you are often doing one-chance into ender without counter breaks, I will always guess here. Always. Why not? If I’m right I break the combo, if I’m wrong I take no extra damage than if I didn’t guess. There is no penalty at all.
I understand your frustration, but I want to try to get you thinking about the combo system/guess breaking differently, because I don’t think this statement is true at all, and I don’t think anybody who analyzes the in-game situations using math can prove it.
Limiting the number of breaks in a match is verifiably not a good idea simply because of the amount of damage these characters can do. We have characters that can get upwards of 60-70% damage off of a counter break is one of the lowest damage characters in the game, and with a single bar of meter he has a 40% one chance break combo. If you remove the fear of being broken, Mira only needs to bide her time before she can land a free 90% meterless beat down, or grab a bar or 2 to finish you off completely.
Killer Instinct is built around constant 2 way interaction. The devs have been adding more opportunities to break as the game has gone on, while also making combo breaking less and less advantageous. There is no way they’re going to go backwards and make it so there’s fewer opportunities to shift the momentum.
@Infilament said it best. Too low a limit, and we turn into MvC with Touch of Death combos. Too high, and it the limit might as well not exist at all.
The breaking game is already heavily in the offense’s favor. If they’re truly guessing, 2/3 times they’ll lock out. If you find a pattern in their breaks (like always breaking a certain double or mashing frame 1 breaks) counter break them or throw off their breaking with Opener>Linker. Use manuals, resets, unique combo traits, set-ups, varying lengths of combos… There are plenty of ways to make yourself harder to break. I’m sure you can figure it out.
I don’t get the point at all. You are loosing to scrubs because of combo breaker? How come? Being “a scrub” myself i must say that most of the times when try to guess i get a lock out that makes me loose like 50% of a bar, depending on the char i will loose 70% or more. Since i see your name on the top killer list all the time it’s hard for me to understand how a low tier player can combo break you enough to a point that he can win just guessing. On most of my matches its very hard to break more then 5 times without being screwed by counter breaker or a lock, so even if i had a breaking limit it would not make any diference at all. Hard to believe that it could make a diference for a top player also.
How to deal against guess breakers:
-Breaks in the first frame, then next time just use an instant counter breaker for free >40% damage
-Breaks your auto double in the first frame, use a linker instead to get a time lockout
-Breaks your linker before seeing the full animation (breaks a h. Windkick in the first hit), then just insta counter break it
Insta counter breakers are gold against guess breakers