Boss shaolin Patch note 4.0 ideas and discussions lets share ideas before the patch

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Killer instinct patch Note 4.0 Ideas ( not real patch )

This patchnote has been imagined to let the entire cast and the players who love these characters enjoy it entirely.

The goal here is not to nerf/buff too much, but to adjust the characters in difficulty since the last patch of rebalancing.

This game is now 10 year, so the goal here is to let everyone enjoy the characters and the game.

PS: No Ideas = No ideas right now, coming soon before end September :blush: still analyzing the character, the goal is not to nerf but maybe adjustments and correct some bugs, cause many peoples like those characters too.

Don’t be shy to share your ideas

System Changes :

  • Rank matchmaking disconnection don’t give points anymore to both players . ( to avoid tons of fake rage quitter stars that I can mention here if needed).


  • web damage unchanged but has now a slightly bigger hitbox
  • Can now recapture opponents in the air: while doing a air grab ( this to permit her to cash out air combos on the ground when she don’t have meter, just like rash and many other ) ( breakable with X-A buttons) throw move like actual orchid grab. Or maybe another kind of recapture but please make it happen.
  • Has now Longer KV meter: to help her have more fun while in the air with juggles and go Higher. Breakable tho.
  • Sadira can now throw 2 till maximum3 Medium widows Bites while in air combo ( only after manuals linkers!!!) to allow her to go for longer Juggles, 2nd and 3nd widows bite deal 50% less damage.
  • Shadow recluse deal now 3% more damage than the damager ender ( to make a real difference between both) actually its like 1 % difference
  • Salticidae has now slightly bigger hitbox and deal 0.5% more damages in combo ( Heavy breakable)
  • St LK is now advantage +4/+3 was before +4/+1 to allow her using her shadow widows Bite as linker in grounded combo ( Breakable)


  • Dagger assault get a better utility: Maya can now activate the daggers attacks after each hit on block/after manuals(to help her deal more pressure) a lil bit like eagle instinct
  • She can now Throw Temperance dagger after Leap kick ( still punishable)
  • She need help

Kan ra:Help help help help he need help. And adjustements

Aganos: unbreakables combo without breaking chance has to go.

Cinder: reduce pyrobomb hit box, let them work for it

Kilgore: make him a Left -right -down-up character, he would be easier to use

Kim Wu: help help help, some adjustement are needed


  • Shadow Boot hitbox reduced by 25% ( leave the damage alone please) we need him to still stay real character
  • Grab damages reduced by 50% while in combo and instinct ( since he can also deal damage with the Bike recapture)
  • Armored wacky ball is now Punishable with ST HK! Or HP, Like all armored stuff in the game. Or remove armor so it will be more usable for juggles linker in priority
  • Light wacky ball is now: advantage +18/ -12
  • Medium wacky ball is now: advantage +14/ -14
  • Light wacky ball is now: advantage +18/ -16
  • Wacky balls push back are now reduced by 60%( this not affect the wacky ball ender whos the goal is to have you in a wall splat)
  • Shadow battering Ram is now -6 on block
  • Light big bad boot is now -4 on block , was -2 before
  • Medium Big bad boot is now -8 on block was -5 before
  • Heavy big bad boot is now -11 on block, was -8 before
  • Light Battering ram is now -3 on block, was -2 before
  • Medium Battering ram is now -5 on block, was -4 before
  • Heavy battering ram stay -10
  • Wicked tongue is now -8 on block, was -6 before
  • Wicked tongue range reduced by 35% ( to force him take some risks at some ranges) finish full screen
  • Bike in instinct deal 20% less damages since his utility is mostly for recaptures and pressure
  • Don’t get meter anymore from eating projectiles
  • Can’t eat shadow projectiles anymore ( jago and other like fulgore, spinal, shadow Jago etc……)

General Raam:

  • Raam is now allowed to combo stomp with HK when the opponent is on the ground ( find a way but please lets make it happen, he needs it.
  • Raam instinct make stage screen way darker and Raam is slightly visible ( to make it harder for the opponents)

No Ideas ( Jago, Sabrewulf, Glacius, Thunder, Shadow Jago, Orchid, Spinal, Fulgore, TJ Combo, Riptor, Omen, Hisako, Aria, Tusk, Arbiter, Shin Hisako, Mira, Gargos, Eyedol, Eagle )

Don’t be shy to share your ideas.


See yall soon!

B. Shaolin.

1 Like

nerf sadira buff rash

And that’s a nope.

My reasoning is that only the fired up pyrobomb hitboxes are big enough on collision to detonate with any real impact or damage on the opposing player and outside of instinct, fired up doesn’t happen often and only gives you one with the boost.

Cinder needs a lot of buffs, but I don’t see him getting anything but nerfs (again).

His Fireflash needs to be hitbox corrected so that it stops trading with things it shouldn’t trade with. That would be my biggest recommendation for buffs on Cinder.

He’s too easy to use as is with a LOT of one hit chance to break combos for ridiculous damage. I’d say he needs meter gain reduction because he gets it way too fast and easily while doing massive chip damage very quickly.

Kim does need some adjustment, mainly buffs, as does some others.

Glacius: Any Hail Glacius has out floating around disappear on hit. This nerf is needed so bad. Glacius is probably the best character in the game, and this one nerf would do wonders to reign him in just enough. He gets fantastic range, mixups, damage, meterless reversals, and setups with his kit. I don’t know how many Glacius players I’ve seen use Hail as a “get out of jail free” card by using it and have it linger near them and when they are hit correctly for combo, the hail is automatically released and hits the opponent, ending their combo and giving him one in return.

Eagle: Increase time between assists from the Eagle being ready to use.

This list isn’t comprehensive, just some things I’m throwing out there. I’m also aware it’s more nerf than buff, which I’m not against buffing any character, but there are key nerfs that need to be targeted for certain characters.


Replying because while i have laughed at these changes (particularly the pyrobomb when there many clips of characters dodging pyrobomb dets in the game already) posting balance changes is intimidating and people will ridicule you no matter the quality of your changes also while

also whenever I put :bug: :lock: that means I’m keeping a bug in due to the str


+/:bug: :lock: : Jago Shadow Endokouken causes a hard knockdown (w/o using combo trick that unfortunately wont survive til winter (or at least i think wont Keits has been kinda hush beside rash, eagle, and criminality)) so jago players preserve all the setups he gets from shadow endokouken and the reset potential

OR/AND (if you are about that #buffjago life)

+: Shadow Tigers Fury damage increased by ~20% mostly reverting the 3.4 damage ender change and giving him another/a replacement high value shadow

+: 2HK is cancellable into wind kick (or its just cancellable :slightly_smiling_face:)

Obligatory: “do these preserves jagos weaknesses?”
Yes Jago weaknesses are somewhat meh anti-zoning, somewhat short pressure without charge endoukouken dash cancels which nearly always put him at risk and his midrange sucking (quote). 2HK becoming cancellable significantly buffs the threat of his midrange/low presence but relying on post patch versions of windkick to keep safe will eventually lead jago players to ruin. Finally Jago ability to risk return people is very conditional on not dying before popping and getting good value out of the pop. This is probably intended and but I think it weakens his identity of shoto brawler lite-tank (sol-lite) and kinda forces him into this dry setplay character who does fulgore stuff a lil worse but has a normal meter (fulgore does not heal but he DOES have lynx tail and mallet smash so it could be argued he is better at being elena than jago too.)


.* I have no idea how to buff wulf due to him being as good as he can be while maitaining his weaknesses. To remind everyone wulf’s weaknesses are meh defense, he has to rely on a unsafe KINDA reactable overhead which is important since the threat of high attack is important to running strike throw, not having a safe single-hit opener (which makes him susceptible to punishes and SC) and the systems of KI dont act favorably towards what he is good at. There isn’t much extra return for CH combos and defenders have a whole bunch of Under-Night cheater defensive OS (throw teching, delayed throw teching, buffered throw teching, teching throws during a forward dash, teching throws during a backdash, fuzzy jump lk OS, fuzzy abares, teching throws with fuzzy abare, guess SC~throw tech, veil off thro- i mean instinct throw tech.)

PS Honorable mention to RDP negative edge OS for being OD vs dash through

whatever fate those face in the fall will be important for Wulf but if that stuff stays Wulf can use it on offense or when he blocks things


nerf lvl 1 ground bounce ender so its breakable without guessing and that sweep always hits everyone (whatever the riptor nerf was for ground bounce ender do it for glacius even if you fix whiff hkd b/c it should’ve been nerfed the first go around)

this is the closest thing to a reasonable i can put down for this totsugeki merchant


-:Reduce jHP blockstun so defenders can more easily interrupt overheads with mash lights


-:slightly reduce damage after M/H DP after an opener (shago dp stops scaling like a regular attack and starts scaling like auto doubles. This is cool as heck and help gives his juggle bites but devolves into do an opener/linker then dp then mix em up for a lvl 3. For how often he can combo into dp the combat team should consider hitting the pd build. keep it weird cool just make it less degen). Scaling of surge DPs and surge divekicks aren’t touched since they cost meter and encourage juggling and mixing with divekick and i like when shago does that.


:bug: :hammer_and_wrench:: Make it so Sadira is able to preform auto-fang (her combo trait) in CAM. There is command overlap with the ender command and its a loss that feels bad and emblematic of sad ira experience
+: Fang (6HK) is no longer an opener. Launchers being openers is inconsistent (Cinder 2HP and Hisako 2HP aren’t openers, Rash 2HP and Kilgore 2MP are openers) but I believe that its detrimental to her AA game that her primary normal AA doesn’t grant a pd freebie and sadira reliance on juggles means she gets soft KDed then schmixed a lot for ehh reward. The easy thing that comes out of this is sadira gets unbreakable H web HKD but in a game with Hisako 2HP>TK orz, Shin M DP, Maya’s Leap kick and ARIA crescendo I do not think its out of place or inappropriate for the character.

+/-: Nerf the damage if H Kunai but make it a Auto double scaling manual (like shago’s DP). This is kinda related to the change above but H kunai is VERY breakable (dragon kick breakable, TJ tremor recaps breakable) and for a hard knockdown/combos on ground hit which can be done without it. Boosting pd build on H kunai would make it breakable for a reason and encourages fishing for lockouts in juggles and boosts the reward for stLK/INS jc combos and stray AAs things that are unique to sadira but meh in practice. The damage nerf is due to me mathing out that A2A jMP xx H kunai would instantly give level 2 which while not completely unheard of (shago yolo slide into H DP does 13 points of pd and M DP give 9;normal>slide,M/H DP gives a lvl 2) im not comfy giving sadira players that since they deserve less to preserve harmony or justice or lore or whatever


:bug: :lock: /- :Orchid shadow breaker costs 1bar+the rest of her meter
:bug: :hammer_and_wrench: : /- : Opponents can counter break Orchid doing shadow breakers
:bug: :lock: /- : Orchid is no longer able to cancel upper cat into air throw unless she spent both bars on it

Orchid shadow breakers are broken (Not like rash broken but broken) and negatively impact game pace. I understand that but think about who the most vigorous defender of s2 soft kd breaker is . And if they loved skd breaker so much then they should totally love playing orchid

-/+:Orchid gets a crappy backsway or stationary rekka cancel, increase the time it takes to get to a lvl3/lvl 4 H Ichi
when talking with a totally regular normal FG opinion haver, they said that Orchid having backdash cancels would be too strong and if IG would be crazy adding it in


random wise deleted user

and what that deleted user/former orchid main and shin main(lol) said was wise beyond their years and cemented themself as one of the greatest minds of KI not cyberbullyed away. To review :

  • Orchid is -2 after rekka>L 2nd rekka(use L 2nd 90% of the time, H has some gimmicks but is more minus)
  • Orchid can cancel her dash into L rekka to create a frame trap with a 6 frame gap (effectively kinda making Rekka>Rekka>dc Light first rekka -1 )
  • A frame perfectly charged Lvl3 H rekka (+5 oB, not unblockable) frame traps mash lights
  • Most characters lights cannot reach orchid charging H rekka after they block (Spaced) 1st Rekka>L 2nd>H 3rd.
  • Orchid (like most of the cast) can buffer a throw tech during dash so orchid can do rekka>L 2nd>H 3rd>dash and input LP+LK during the dash to block reversal dp and tech mash throw
  • KI ranked players don’t understand frame data, system mechanics or math so they think rekka not as good as it is.

If the Orchid community is not that attached to the empirical stuff that makes rekka good then you can hit a lot of it to make the new rps more manageable. But Orchid players are gonna go nuts (in the good way) if it gets added.

-/ :bug: :hammer_and_wrench:: remove firecat unbreakble opener enders. they are very strong and not very fun to cheat the ender economy See TJ opener shadow powerline for fun ways character can cheat the ender economy


-: nerf PD build on DP after openers. I am a top tier h8r. Like Ice T on the Chappelle Show h8r. Whenever I fight a top tier I don’t feel like an anime protag, I feel like Jimmy McNulty contending in vain against an institution. So with that being said my Fulgore nerf is making sure he doesn’t get to have fun manualling into DP after openers/linkers/clMP and being a better damage engine than jago with minimal/zero meter cost & massive spin speed gains. I like a majority buggy broken stuff in KI but not on people with on purpose broken stuff and Fulgore doing low forward xx fireball xx H DP and doing as much damage as a Heavy auto double is NOT COOL or harmonious

:bug: :lock:/ :bug: :hammer_and_wrench:/+:Increase Fulgore sc catch window by 1 or 2 frames. I got into an arguement with a CB champ, as Im prone to doing, about if bug fixing fulgore/kilgore’s SC catch window removes/decentralizes there on paper weakness. Fulgore is meter reliant so its a very happy accident that his SC is more susceptible to shadow counter baits. Please don’t change or only slightly improve it so to maintain that strategic vector of attack/slim ray of hope of beating a shoto with whiff cancelable fireballs.
-:reduce L and M eye laser range so that the projectile hits where it visually should instead of hitting characters hurtboxes underground with a phantom hitbox.

Ill add s2 and s3 later

1 Like

:thinking: many good things in there. thanx for your time! :laughing:

Honestly, other than bug fixes, I don’t think Cinder needs a ton of buffs. I see him regularly used in tournaments and Nicky actually won a tourny using him during his (You Choose Who I Play series). If I was to rank Cinder, I would put him near the top 10 (maybe 12 or 13th spot). The largest problem I see with Cinder is that most people (at least in Ranked) have virtually no idea how to use him correctly. You can’t play him straight forward as you would other characters as his damage is too low. He’s all about using his pyros to keep you grounded, while he pressures you and keeps you lit on fire, and then does one-chances into high damage.

You also have to consider that we know that Rash is getting nerfed as well as the majority of Cinder’s worse MUs, so in the end, I think he’ll be stronger just by proxy. I think what hold’s Cinder back, isn’t that he isn’t good, but that most people would rather play a character that isn’t as complex. He falls into the same trap that Gargos and Kan-Ra are in. They are powerful but require much more effort than the rest of the cast.

Sadira on the other hand, I do see getting buffed. She is widely regarded as the worse character in the game with only her Instinct being her saving grace. I do agree with this reality. There are just too many other characters that occupy her space that do things way better, namely, Mira, Rash, and Maya.

I don’t see Sadira getting massive buffs to be fair. Some options that have been floated around on the KI Discord servers was turning her H-Recluse into a DP. I mean it’s kind of already there. It has the DP damage and out of instinct she can’t combo off of it. It has slow start up, so it could be stuffed. This would help her against her awful corner defense. If they don’t want to do that, they could allow her to drop a web out of instinct, similar to Thunder’s Call of the Sky. She wouldn’t be able to drop them back to back, like she does in Instinct. She would have to buff herself like Thunder does and then drop a web. All in all, what Sadira needs most is better defensive options.

We don’t honestly know how big a shake up this patch is going to be. I do believe that Keits and Co will make it special, but we’ll have to wait and see.

1 Like

Personally, I’d want the color-coding removed from Spinal’s skulls in the next, just because it’s incredibly unnecessary.