Additional universal mechanics

Been kind of thinking on the idea of adding universal mechanics to the game. We only have the breakers, but I was pondering if EVERY character also had Stagger, flipout, recapture.

Not every character that has these tools uses them necessarily the same. Some recaps cost shadow others dont, most staggers are heavy buttons, flipouts are light normals generally and few are specials.

But I wonder about the thoughts of the community on this, if every character had every tool would that be so bad? The game is too far ahead to really think about it for now, but I wonder what this might have done to the game. I’m fine with the way it is now, but i also think this could’ve made room for more free flow play styles. Granted everyone plays these characters in very unique ways, but thought it’d be a nice topic of discussion.

Just as a purely hypothetical discussion? If this were the case…

Glacius wouldn’t seem to get much from having a flipout. Same with Aganos, really.

Shadow Jago would be as aggressive as a Sabrewulf or Rash with a flipout. Kim Wu and Tusk are ridiculously scary to imagine with one.

I cant see with giving Cinder a stagger his potential skyrocketing.

Orchid with a recapture, man, i might just put my controller down if she cornered me.

It’d be a very, very different KI to what is in place now. But something fun to imagine though.

As an aside…i thought it was kinda cool when only TJ had a recapture move.

but orchid recaps with air throw

Kinda. I think it ground bounces in combo and recaptures out of combo.

1 Like

I like to think of these mechanics the same way I think of projectiles. Not every character has a fireball, and not every character needs one.

I think I’d prefer to keep these extra mechanics limited to a certain selection of characters rather than giving them to everyone.

I think the same way, but this is kind of a food for thought topic to me. It wouldnt be ‘healthy’ for the game but hey…

1 Like

which is true, but I like to think of stagger as a similar thing to stun which we don’t have. So closer to Crush Countering in SFV, you get something extra for taking a big button that rewards you for proper timing in neutral. Especially when it comes to counter hitting with those slower buttons.

ground bounce in combo, recap if caught in air. But in essence a recap, I’m not saying that each one works in simplest of terms. Like I said there are variables to recaps for each character that has one. There could be variables to the staggers each character has. but I think a flipout should be a thing every character gets.

I can see what you mean. But I don’t know if everyone has a button big enough to warrant it being universal. Tusk, Hisako, and TJ have made it centralized part of their gameplan, while Aganos, Riptor, Wulf, and Shago all use an outstandingly slow/unsafe button to get the effect. A few characters like Gargos, Kim, and Eyedol get stagger off of certain specials.

There are a few others I think could benefit from it but otherwise I dunno if it needs to be too much more widespread. Plus there are a few characters I think are too fast/flighty to warrant so much hitstun.

I wouldn’t mind everyone getting flip out. Surely no one could be worse than Thunder with his left, right, high, low, throw, command grab, double cross up with dp flip out mix up that he can go into from a shadow damage ender or after cashing out a juggle or after landing a raw shadow grab or after just yoloing an unreactable full screen overhead cross up stomp. It’s ok though, his borderline insane mix up game is balanced out by his low damage… oh wait.

but if every character had the mechanic I don’t think that it would be as powerful as you think. I think of ken or ibuki for example, ibuki having crush counters and flipouts but she is a pretty fast character.

I know people hate to compare SFV and KI as they both are definitely very different types of games but I wonder how this truly would’ve effected the cast and without the means to test it we wouldn’t know. But it’d be much like season 1 i feel like because EVERYONE has something crazy

And they don’t now?

I’m with @Fwufikins.

1 Like

not saying they don’t now. an implementing the mechanics to the characters that don’t have them would have to be done in unique ways. They aren’t things that could simply be copy pasted. Orchid’s recap for example only works under certain conditions. Say jago’s stagger was only achievable off a fully charged fireball landing raw.

I really don’t think flipout or stagger for the entire cast would be that particularly bad. More specifically flipouts.

I dunno, I’m already thinking of really dirty setups that characters like Glacius, Orchid and Kim could do if they could flipout after juggles. It could affect balance much more than you think.

Stagger not as much but I think it could still apply.

1 Like

Enlighten me on Glacius because i dont really see it. He doesn’t start a lot of juggles to me as he stands now. Jumping in on hail or s. puddle punch seem like his “launcher” options to get the party started.

This may be a rare occurrence, but let’s say your opponent jumps into a hail while he has two hails up. Juggles st.LK flipout off the hail, cold shoulders under, 2nd hail hits crossup.

Probably some other instances that I gotta think of.

…If i got hit with that, id retire from KI…

Kappa

if someone cold shoulder cross undered me after a flip out that would be skill of the player. Flip outs are breakable so you could stop it from happening. Like I keep saying I think it would add more flare to players and they character play style. Try to think of overall properties of each mechanic, which I think you’re doing, but put it realistically.

In your scenario, rare occurrence glacius almost NEVER gets a juggle state. But say he does, in that scenario he isn’t very different from shin sako, not very different from spinal, nor kan ra and gargos. We all know to block away from where the character is in relation to yours.

I can see what you mean.

Like if glacius flipped me out and I reactively did a dp he liquidized to cross under and punish before i landed from flip that’d be a read of the player instead of taking the block and punishing (despite being a fair option) he could potentially get the counter hit damage because of it.