So I’m going to try to be positive despite how hard it is for me lately. I asked Keits one question while at CEO – if they were going to make any changes to Fulgore’s instinct. He said no, so it looks like we’re stuck with it.
That said, has anyone figured out anything useful for it? I’m genuinely curious if there’s something out there that I’m missing. Outside of confirming a fireball into devastation beam I haven’t found anything at all, and even that usually isn’t worth it unless you know it will kill.
Crazy fireball and laser and teleport cancels; that is the use of it.
I’m sorry but if you don’t use pip cancels very much than yes, you will have a hard time making use of his instinct. But if you already do things like canceling fireball into teleport, blade dash into upper cut, and more, then just imagine getting to do as much of that as you want for free for 15 seconds. Also he can manually gain pips, so that’s some surface level utility…
Define “crazy” for me please. Just throwing this out there - if fulgore hits with all three fireballs in instinct mode he does 23 damage and lowers his reactor speed 3 times. In comparison, if Jago hits with his double fireball in instinct he does 32 damage, gains health back, and gains meter. If we’re talking blade dash into uppercut, the uppercut does between 8-11% with no follow up. If we’re talking about going for fireball teleport mixup, the teleport now lowers your reactor speed 3 (I think its 3 now, it was dramatically increased) levels, the fireball lowers it one, so you’d better land your combo or you’ve devastated your meter gain. And if you go that route, you’ll only get maybe two fireball teleport mix ups in the 15 seconds, so out instinct would save us exactly 2 pips. Is an instinct mode that saves us half of one bar (while still reducing reactor speed) a good thing?
So again, unless I’m missing something, its either save half of one bar going for most likely a max of 2 mix ups, or throw a ton of fireballs out, but they don’t do any damage in comparison to other fireballs in the game (seriously, fulgore’s fireballs do slightly less than even omen’s). Also, manually gaining a pip is cool and all, but you need a hard knock down to safely earn a quarter of a bar. Compare that to any character with a resource ender.
Is there really nothing else to this?
Please don’t act like I’m an idiot, I can be an emotional player, but I fully understand how pip cancels work, and believe it or not, when his instinct gave meter I used to pip cancel constantly. Now I’m consciously trying not to because NOT having at least 4 pips for a shadow move or counter is pretty horrible late in the game when your opponent gets their meter or instinct pressure.
Lastly, let me throw this question out there: Are we better off using instinct and destroying our meter gain, or are we better off playing like storm did in the 3.8 changes post going for max meter gain? If we ignore instinct, we get the meter to use all of those same options plus shadow moves and counters, plus skates and beam (once it builds enough). Unless someone has some crazy tech I don’t know about (hence the reason for the post) it seems like NOT using instinct is more beneficial.
One thing I’ve always wondered about adjusting was his “recharge” ability during Instinct. I personally preferred it was similar to Season 1, where it would recharged at a rate instead of adding a set value of pips. However, it should be much faster because of the pace of the match, it should also have the ability to increase the spin reactor speed with the duration of recharging. That would give more value to his Instinct and give Fulgore an option to have his reactor speed spinning without having to force himself into a combo and instead have a defensive front as well.
Would be interesting, though not sure if it would be applicable to your needs or in competitive play whatsoever since I don’t main Fulgore.
That’s my problem, currently I see zero use for it and his current lack of meter has kind of made me start to hate the character. Like I said though, I’m trying to be positive which is why I’m asking to see if anyone else has found anything special with it.
Sure: Most don’t get anything significant at low ender levels. Midscreen, fulgore’s getting 3 pips safely from doing any level of launcher ender into stand HK (which isn’t a combo bottleneck, since you can juggle with other stuff before ending with that.) So, from a level 1 ender, he’s getting close to a full bar. In the corner he can only get 2 pips safely, but he still gets meaty pressure, with enough time for an overhead.
Since you said compare to any character with a resource ender, I’ll choose thunder, who gets something like 1/8th of a bar from a level 1 battery ender. Including the combo before it, it’ll be more like 1/4th to 1/3rd of a bar. Fulgore is looking pretty good in comparison.
He also gets 2 pips from his throw midscreen (so, half a bar.) Most characters build a negligible amount of meter from a throw, just eyeballing it it looks like about 1/16th of a bar, maybe less. Notable exceptions are shadow jago and shin hisako, who build closer to 1/5th of a bar. So even compared to the second best throws, his is at least twice as rewarding in terms of resources…
I’m not sure why “not using instinct” is a good idea, since all it does is enhance Fulgore in some capacity (ie, there is no downside to using it). Intentionally sitting on instinct doesn’t seem to help him in any way.
I also think you are probably undervaluing manual charge. If you do, like… H L L fireball pattern, then backdash, you will be able to build probably 2 pips for free against any character without a teleport (so, most of them). If you want to run away and build pips with manual charge, you probably can get 4 to 6 pretty easily on most instincts. And it’s hard to challenge because Fulgore can be sneaky and turn any of those fireballs into a teleport mixup at will, so you have to respect it.
That said, I do kind of agree that his instinct took a hit when they removed laser -> fireball (not just H laser, all lasers) and fireball zoning hurts less now. But I don’t think his instinct is useless, just below average. Manual charge after free triple fireballs (with the threat of mixup at any time) is probably its best use now.
I don’t know why, but I really hadn’t thought of doing a st hk after a launcher and then charging three times. That actually sounds pretty solid. I’m definitely going to see how much mileage I can get out of that.
Infil – what I mean by “not using instinct” is that pip cancelling REALLY destroys your reactor speed. Especially if you teleport thanks to that change. With how much his projectiles have been nerfed too, doing a small amount of damage is not worth minimal spin speed. Opening them up is a little different, you can do damage there, but like I said before, it only costs 1 pip to do a teleport mix up, not exactly something “special” to save for when you’re in instinct mode. I will say, I do like what DEClimax suggested, I might seriously just play my first instinct bar around seeing how many pips I can build.
Having full pips for skates + the threat of shadow or even the threat of beam is far, far, far greater than zoning with fireballs that do less damage than Omen’s and still reduce your reactor speed.
You should also keep in mind that you can build meter during pip-cancel-enhanced zoning. Creating situations where you have some space and slow fireballs on the screen can give you opportunities to charge your meter in neutral. Opening them up with teleport mixups is just one part of the equation, a single tool in a larger toolbox of things fulgore can do with his instinct.
You could probably make your decisions about how to use his instinct based on the spin speed you have at the start. If your spin speed is already pretty good, it doesn’t make too much sense to tank it by sitting back and zoning, so you should probably go for the big meter payouts from launcher ender combos and throws, and if you do well offensively you’ll likely end your instinct close to a full bar. On the other hand, if you pop instinct with slow spin speed, you should feel more at liberty to take advantage of his free pip cancels. Whether that’s teleport mixups or up close pressure or just filling the screen with crap so you can slip in a charge is your call.
Well, I agree that if your ultimate goal is to get 10 pips then you probably shouldn’t be using the pip cancels much. But the cool thing about Fulgore is that he’s pretty versatile, so like Climax said, if you pop instinct and have no spin speed and no pips right now, then you can feel free to tank your spin speed with zoning and teleports (because you’re already at rock bottom), maybe sneaking in some manual pip charges here and there as you cover yourself with multi fireballs. If you land a hit on the teleport mixup (which seems pretty reasonable to assume), you can quickly convert it into 4 or 5 pip increases, end with launcher ender, and manually build 3 pips. Or mix up with throw for 2 pips + speed increase + the reactor building meter during throw animation.
If you already do have high speed, then you can choose to ignore the zoning and do some rushdown, which is greatly enhanced by good spin speed (for example, throws now build way more meter). Or you could run away a bit and let the spin speed do work building meter for you, playing with only your normals, blade dash, and DP anti-air. I think a lot of Fulgore players are quick to throw a fireball when they are far away, which cuts into the spin speed increase. With high spin speed, you should actually play a bit more reactively (DP jumps or approaches) and build 1 or 2 pips without doing anything.
But the cool thing is that you can choose how to use it based on what’s going on, you aren’t boxed in to only one situation like some other characters might be.
Okay, after playing about 20 games today, I can say I’ve had zero luck so far…
I’m not giving up yet, and I’m not going to rant yet, but I’m kinda reaching the point of just being depressed about the current state of this character…
Well, so much for positivity. 13 brand new nerfs. I’d like to say thank you to everyone who took the time to give me advice, but I’m definitely done now. Maybe I’ll try another character, but I’ll never again play Fulgore.