Eagle: An Actual In-Depth Gameplay Discussion

While I’m tempted to say that Eagle should be heavily influenced by Fulgore and Thunder, I actually think they should go the other way.

Sure, maybe have a few nods to them in terms of animations, especially Fulgore for story reasons, but I’d rather they not go the Shago route, even if they did an awesome job of making him feel unique.

Here’s what I’d like to see:

Story wise, make him a brainwashed Ultratech suit. Black trench coat, sunglasses (that he always loses on the first hit of a match) that hide one mechanical eye and one regular eye, pony tail, etc.

I’d want him to be cold, unfeeling, and now more of a wild card that’s torn between wanting to destroy Ultratech and wanting to run it himself.

I’d also give him a high tech weapon, like a sword that can extend to a whip, but is also capable of electromagnetic pulse charges.

I’d also want him to have Thunder’s old Phoenix projectile, but maybe he uses Fulgore’s projectile animation to throw it.

Sorry, not in-depth here. I could go further on his moves, but I’d mainly want them to involve the projectile, the sword at close range, and extending the sword, so he’d be kind of a mid-range zoner.
I did more of a full breakdown in a different thread. Not saying I’d keep all of this, but these were my ideas:

Whatever they’re called, I hope he keeps some sort of wrist mounted blade weapons. I’m pretty sure the only place Eagle was ever depicted was in the comics, so they should at least keep something from his original design. Plus it ties him to Fulgore… Though I still think he should have Fulgore’s ponytail. :stuck_out_tongue:

Also according to the comics, his name is “Black Eagle” apparently. Though like Black Orchid and Chief Thunder I expect it to be shortened to just Eagle.

1 Like

Maybe that can be retro eagle?

1 Like

Hopefully a retro Eagle costume wouldn’t suffer from the same overly sensitive politically correctness that Thunder’s does.

1 Like

@xCrimsonLegendx pro-stereotyping, eh? Noted.

We don’t own the rights to the comics, so we can’t copy them, and honestly, we don’t want to repeat what they did anyway with the characters.

Here’s something to think about - what exactly did Glacius take? A person? A body? You may be jumping to conclusions. Or not. We’re not telling.

6 Likes

Oh boy, Eagle’s been cloned!

1 Like

I’m going back to the drawing board. He didn’t take the Eagle, he obviously took an Eagle!


Also, Adam, I’d be curious. Are there any ideas for what Eagle’s game plan could be? I can understand if you want to avoid a leaky and want to avoid spoilers, but I’m curious to get a opinions on what the tangible, playable aspect of a theoretical Eagle that people have.

1 Like

I’m not pro-steroytyping. >__<

I’m just not very fond of the costume Thunder wound up with, half of my family is of native origins and I’ve asked a great deal of them what they thought of the original design and frankly none of them were offended. He looked more like a mad-max psychopath with a feather mohawk than a native american. Heck my niece and nephew were kind of insulted when I showed them Thunder’s modern design, telling me in their innocent childlike ways “That’s not what they look like” and whatnot.

The only thing that was mildly offensive about old Thunder was some of his vocal work, at least to me and my family. Sorry if that sounded like I support stereotypes because I don’t. It just seemed like you guys had to walk around on eggshells so you didn’t offend, I respect the decision you had to make as I’m not a developer but I’ve just got to say that retro Thunder stands out as one of the worst retros in the game, not because it looks bad but because it’s simply not accurate. I’m sure when/if Eagle makes it into KI he’ll look awesome in his own way and play even better, that’s just what you guys do. I have faith in the character and the team.

Anywho, thanks for taking the time to reply. The Eagle/Thunder/Fulgore plot point is one of the best in the game and the way things have been presented so far have really been stirring the pot, I can’t wait to see how its all fleshed out.

4 Likes

It’s this kind of interaction from the developers of KI that keep me playing this game!

If you had told me Microsoft would make a good fighting game 4 years ago I would have asked you how much have you had to drink today?

Who or what is Eagle? What will Glacius do with the body? Remember this game is rated “T” for teen guys. :alien::syringe:+:bird:= ???

2 Likes

This.

Also, I am happy how Boxer in SFV turned out in the end. So much energy when I look at him. Wish Thunder was that frightening looking (without starting any baseless or useless discussion about ethnicity).

2 Likes

I just want him to look and play fully unique and original, and not have any moves or aesthetics taken from any of the other characters.

1 Like

Great post, you sure took him to school! haha wooooo

I’m telling you guys, eagle is kelvin aka rushdown glacius. That’s what I’m guessing at least lol.

1 Like

That’s exactly what I’m thinking, if not, I still want rushdown glacious lol

1 Like

Wasn’t trying to take anyone to school, just an attempt to backup my previous post. I don’t want anyone thinking I’m okay with negative stereotypes because I’m not, I appreciate when things are sensitive to different groups of people whether they be races, genders, religions, what have you but I start to get concerned when situations arise that cause people to be overly cautious so they don’t offend anyone.

I’m not saying that’s whats going on with KI at all but I honestly can’t see the racially insensitive factors in Thunder’s classic outfit. Again, some of his voice lines were mildly offensive in the old game but that wouldn’t carry over into this game. The only things remotely Native American about his original look was some ornamental feathers on his head and his weapons of choice. The rest was a quasi-Borderlands Bandit looking guy with camo pants, a huge belt buckle and a little paint on his eyes. I totally love Thunder’s modern look and I’m glad that they went the extra mile to make sure he was authentic as possible, it really shows as one of the best designs of season one.

Anywho, I don’t really want to derail the thread any further with talk of what’s morally right and wrong with the world and everything, I just know that Thunder’s retro could have been a lot better.

2 Likes

You’re absolutely right and I agree with you too.

I think if Eagle does become playable (which is likely) we can expect him to be a mix of both Thunder and Fulgore I can totally see that happening in a way.

2 Likes

I’ll only respond with this, as I don’t want to derail the thread and you’re more than entitled to your opinion, but I just wanted to point a few things out.

His old costume was a Native American stereotype by simple virtue of the fact that it wasn’t historically accurate. They took a dude, slapped some paint and feathers on him and gave him some gibberish war cries. That’s stereotyping.

Yes, and that’s fine, but that’s an awfully small sample size to draw a conclusion from, and is it at least possible that there might be some confirmation bias in there? Either way, some not being offended by something doesn’t automatically make that something not offensive to others or simply not offensive in general.

You’re talking a historically accurate depiction, as consulted by actual historians, versus what your niece and nephew, who are children, have to say on the subject? We’re talking facts versus emotion. Sorry, but facts win every time. At least they should.

Not really, and this is important, because I don’t really get the premise here that the only reason why they did this was to not offend people. Couldn’t they just prefer to do something accurately without having the PC police force them in to doing it that way? Why is that not an option for them? Why do you immediately jump to PC police made them do it or they only did this to avoid offending people?

I’m pretty sure Adam’s said on multiple occasions that they simply didn’t like how the old Thunder looked and sounded and they wanted to do something more accurate this time around and that should be their choice as developers.

I’m not trying to jump on you here, man. I enjoy reading your posts. I just think you might be making assumptions on how all of this played out and maybe, possibly relying on a small sample size to reinforce your own, pre-existing opinion.

I mean… Do you think the Washington NFL football team’s name is offensive? A lot of Native Americans don’t. Does that mean it’s not offensive? Well, the team’s been sued several times by tribes going all the way back to the 1950s and the fact of the matter is that the word is a historical racial pejorative. The only argument Dan Snyder, the team’s owner seems to have against it is history, as in “it’s been that way decades, we have a rich history and shouldn’t change it.”

Thunder looked that way before, so even if it might or might not offend others, even if it is a collection of stereotypes, are you saying MS/IG should just ignore that just because of history?

[quote=“Iago407, post:27, topic:12863, full:true”]His old costume was a Native American stereotype by simple virtue of the fact that it wasn’t historically accurate. They took a dude, slapped some paint and feathers on him and gave him some gibberish war cries. That’s stereotyping. [/quote]Stereotype or not, was it offensive? Is Mcree in Overwatch a negative stereotype because he’s a gun-slinging cowboy with a metallic cyborg arm? I mean he’s not historically accurate, so that should mean they’re perpetuating a stereotype right?

[quote=“Iago407, post:27, topic:12863, full:true”]
You’re talking a historically accurate depiction, as consulted by actual historians, versus what your niece and nephew, who are children, have to say on the subject? We’re talking facts versus emotion. Sorry, but facts win every time. At least they should.[/quote]My sister’s half of the family is steeped in tradition, their house is filled with Native American artifacts, they are active with their tribe and there’s even a homemade totem poll next door at Grandma’s house that the family carved together. They’ve even got a set of headdresses that they take to ceremonies on occasion. These kids know what’s up, as far as my family’s reaction to Thunder some of them seemed to think that Thunder’s modern look was more of a stereotype than the mad-max original design. A guy with tomahawks and a bear on his head is a more stereotypical native american than a surgically implanted feather mohawk. :stuck_out_tongue:

I’m just looking at things from my own perspective like you said and yeah it seems like the new KI has gone a little out of its way to make sure its not offensive. (not that its a bad thing) The game is rated T instead of M, the “sex appeal” has been completely whitewashed what with the refusal of things like Orchid’s costume as well as Kim’s. The Thunder issue we’ve been discussing. At times I look at the game and I wonder why its been toned back, the originals weren’t super gory but they had some graphic finishes, they had instances of Orchid flashing her top to kill someone, the female characters were “sexy” for what they were. They had people being shot, impaled (now due to ratings we couldn’t even have Hisako’s blade pass through a torso), burned alive, it was a somewhat brutal experience on top of the lighthearted comedy act. The game has been toned down significantly in some regards.

I think get why they’ve done what they’ve done and I really don’t want to sound like some proponent of sleaze and stereotyping, because I’m not I just don’t really like censoring for the sake of it. I love Killer Instinct, I love Chief Thunder, I love Orchid, I love everything about the game. I just want it to be all it can be and I don’t want anyone to have to give second thoughts to design choices to uphold and maintain the non-offensive package. In this day and age people are offended by everything, I guess I just kinda get tired of hearing about it. :sweat:

1 Like