Liu Kang / Scorpion vs. Jago / Cinder

Don’t know if any of you guys ever frequent Comicvine.com, but a battle thread was just refreshed with the characters in the title.

Who do you guys think would win? In a debate setting, what arguments would you use to prove your case?

This is a KI forum, who do you think is gonna get more support? :u

I dont know,that one guy posted on there that Jago with the power of Gargos is ready to beat the crap out of anyone and everything…so there for he wins. lol…I thought that was a good answer.

Umm…I’m asking for an opinion. I just want to read what people think about his topic. This isn’t some vote, it’s a discussion. Again…

That guy on there is me. That is my argument against Liu and Scorpion.

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Liu kang can turn into a freaking dragon and bite you in half. End of challenge. Thats the second best fatality of all time, falling just behind quan chi’s leg rip as the greatest.

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Scre w Liu Kang, Scorpion, Jago and Cinder. Chuck Norris can hit in them face with his beard!

Well if I were to be serious, no Mortal Kombat characters should even be able to TOUCH Cinder. When MK characters get lit on fire, they don’t take white damage, they take ACTUAL damage. Instant loss.

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Because a man engulfed in fire and an undead ninja specter are “serious” characters to begin with.

Rain still can get hurt by fire. End of story.

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In the new MKX comic, Subzero is shown overcoming temperatures in excess of 3000°. Subzero can extinguish Cinder’s flames for a time at least, and then be able to finish him. There is the caveat that Cinder can go super nova though (sun temperatures are in excess of 5000°)

Other characters too like Kenshi, or Ermac, or say Quan Chi would also be able to do massive damage to Cinder just on the fact that they can attack from a distance with TK or sorcery and are able to eviscerate their competition. Quan Chi especially (going off gameplay mechanics) can combo purely off projectiles in to distanced trance resets. Quan’s Sorcery is seriously off the chain.

All in all it comes down to matchups. Scorpion does have an OP option against Cinder (teleportation to the Netherrealm), but to make the thread on CV more fun we took that option off the table.

I meant being serious about the argument itself. Not the characters.

That’s because they’re not constantly on fire like when Cinder does it. Every MK character just shoots out fire for a second and then it’s over. It’s not like Burnout where you’re literally forced to stop attacking because you’ll be on fire for even longer when you do. And I think it would apply more effectively to MK since many strings rely on both punches and kicks anyway.

You ever play Test Your Luck and get those meteors? Those things light you on fire like Cinder’s burnout AND make you take REAL damage instead of white damage. Imagine if it worked like Burnout where you can’t press punch or kick to make it go away. Especially for a game like MK where each button is equally important.

Forgive me if this makes me sound stupid, but I don’t see what this does against Cinder. How does this help Scorpion exactly?

2 ways…

  1. Depending on the rules of the fight, Scorpion could technically get a win through what is call ‘Battle Field Removal’ (BFR) on the CV site.
  2. Scorpion continually get stronger and strong in the Netherrealm, and he is effectively immortal, thus he’ll eventually win no matter what since if he takes Cinder there, Cinder will eventually die on his own.

Liu Kang and Scorpion would win by a long shot here is why

  1. Liu kang is the MK champion in the original and alternate time line. He defeated Shao Kahn twice, Shinnok and all those who participated in the first 3 games (minus Raiden). Although killed by Quan chi and Shang Tsung later he still was stronger than both separately. He must of beaten scorpion in order to have progressed to the final. In the new time line he beat Shang and Shao (although he was not at max power) and outworld warriors but killed by raiden

  2. Scorpion being undead gives him a major advantage (although he was killed in Armageddon by sub-zero) so unless quan chi is dead or he was human again he cannot be killed

  3. Jago loses a lot of fights and so does cinder to other killer instinct character and the strongest canon killer instinct characters most likely are Fulgore Mk 3 (A.K.A Eagle) and Hisako with no loses

  4. Cinder is cocky and that could get the best of him and hell-fire beats normal fire. Liu kang is just way to strong for jago (as much as I like jago).

Good break down, but…

  1. Well, for number one there is no but…LK is a beast, and against Jago, Jago has an uphill battle. Still though, Shadow Jago is / should be more powerful that LK off top, it’s just that LK is that much more skilled and experienced than Jago in any incarnation. Anyway, I’m actually planning on revisiting that CV thread after the Shago trailer, and after the other story stuff drops for him and Jago respectively. Though I agree that LK is above Jago in many respects, I still think that Jago can beat him given the right approach.

  2. Scorpion is undead, but Hanzo isn’t. As of MKX, Hanzo has regained his life, and as such Scorpion has gained a weakness. It is this weakness that I was exploiting in my argument for Cinder against him.

  3. Jago has lost some fights (he lost to Fulgore, and he lost to Cinder iirc), but Cinder (iirc) is undefeated in this new KI. Yes Ben lost to Aria before he became Cinder, but after his transformation he pretty much ran through all the completion.

  4. Cinder’s cockiness is a double edged sword. Regardless of that fact though, in this new incarnation it was said that he can actually go supernova if he wants, meaning that he can actually set the air on fire if he pushes himself. That being the case, there is no way that Scorpion, Hanzo, would be able to defeat him as he’d be incinerated if Cinder got “serious”.

All in all, I think Cinder vs. Scorpion would either be a stalemate, or Cinder would win. And LK vs. Jago, is still up in the air for me…until Shago drops.

Well Liu beat Shao Kahn who is unbelievably powerful more so than a thunder god, also he beat shinnok and shadow jago is just jago + omen (both have a bad win streak)

Hanzo has stated he still has scorpions power (aside from the undead bit) so he still has hell-fire abilities as well as things like a teleport and a spear, and if it was scorpion he gets stronger in the never-realm (even though he would not need it)

No he has been defeated many times…

By T.J Combo, Hisako, Maya, Aganos, Kan-Ra

The only undefeated characters are Hisako and Fulgore Mk3 (Eagle)

Like I said Scorpion is undead
Also Hanzo would not waste time by letting him get to that stage he is also a hot head also ‘hellfire vs normal fire’

Honestly Liu can do it by himself since he beat and Elder god Shinnok (in the original time line and they cannot be killed) and beat someone as tough as a god (Shao Kahn). Shadow Jago may be powerful but its just jago possessed by omen who gets beat by Kan-Ra and ARIA as well when he no longer needs jagos body since he is powerful enough not to need it

Kahn was held back because of the tournament. When LK fought someone powerful (Raiden) he died. Kahn fought Raiden heads up and won. If Liu fought Kahn heads up outside of the tournament, he’d loose too.

Hanzo has the hell-fire in him still yes, but that is sort of meaningless in the midst of a supernova.

I could be wrong, I don’t know. From the looks of the timeline though, one of the last things to happen in the S2 story was Cinder defeating Sadira, and pondering the future. I’ll look into it.

Again, Hanzo isn’t undead.

And FYI, LK only beat the likes of Kahn and Shinnok with the help of others, namely the Elder Gods. The EGs are the ones who put the rules of Mortal Kombat in place, which allowed him to fight Shinnok and Kahn in the first place, as without the rules of engagement, LK would have died.

Beyond that though, Raiden protected LK’s soul in MK3 which is why he didn’t die in the game’s prologue. And though LK did defeat Kahn AFTER Kahn “killed” Kung (LK was said to have gone into a rage at the sight of Kung’s death), it was during the Outworld merger which is canonically when character like Raiden (did you know that Raiden and Kahn are of the same race?) loose their godhood. Canonically Kahn was weakened during this act. (There was a lot more going on during this point, but I won’t go into it.)

And in MK4, LK was defeated by Quan and the others prior to going and asking for help from Sonya and the other Earth fighters (check out his MK4 bio). During the final battle of MK4 though, Quan Chi, Raiden, and the EGs played a MAJOR role in taking Shinnok down a peg, where afterwards it is speculated that LK beat him in Mortal Kombat (see that? Shinnok isn’t mortal, but he was forced to fight in Mortal Kombat)…then again, it could have been Raiden who defeated him, we just don’t know.

So yeah, I’ll look into Cinder’s win streak, but I still say going supernova is a HUGE hurdle that neither LK or Scorpion could overcome in a fair fight with him.