Is the priority system incorrect?

I was in the lab with Omen when i came across his standing far LK. I noticed that on the ground, it is basically useless, but it hits high and fast, so i thought it could be a good anti air. I remember @TheKeits saying that all ground moves have priority over air moves. I made a Jago perform some jump ins on me.

When i attempted to counter Jagos air hits with Omen’s light kick, I noticed that that if the hit boxes of both moves hit at the same time, the hits “trade”. How is this possible? If ground moves take priority over air moves, then shouldn’t an even trade result in a counter hit for ONLY the grounded person?

I thought that maybe the situation i was testing was a little to ambiguous, so i then had Jago do neutral jump HK. Then i put Omen at a range where he couldn’t be hit, but standing LK would reach out and touch Jagos kick hitbox. What happened was JAGO got counter hits, and i didnt. I thought the Air-to-Ground rule overrides the Light-Medium-Heavy rule. Can someone please release a DETAILED version of the hit priority system?

Aerial attacks only have -1 priority, so a jumping medium will trade with a standing light, jumping special with a standing heavy, etc.

Edit: it goes light < medium < heavy < special < shadow with -1 for aerials. If you were to put numbers on it, a grounded shadow would be a 5 and an aerial light would be a 0, but a grounded light and an aerial medium would both be 1.

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Very cool. Thank you.

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Completely correct.

I always advise using a standing heavy attack or crouching heavy attack for an anti air.

In respect to Omen though, if possible use his Sabrewulf fireball anti-air. The timing is a bit tricky, but it covers well.

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Nailed it. Thanks Bane.

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So why does sometimes Omens hvy standing kick get beat by Jagos jumping hvy kick or jumping med kick?
I never understood why that would beat a standing anti air hvy kick?
Especially with Omens lack of a decent Anti air special

Omen’s heavy kick should beat any air attack. If thats not happening, then the attack is missing.

happens all the time. Jago jumps in, I knock him out of the sky when he doesnt kick. Jumps again, does Hvy kick in air…my foot touches his foot. He wins

Turn the hitboxes on, record a replay, frame step it, and check again. You’ll get the real story that way.

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Ok, Ill try that… I didnt know you could turn them on in a replay. Cool.
Im assuming Jagos move must be coming out a split second before mine. I dont really understand hit boxes and hurt boxes…but Ill give it a go.
Thanks

Solid Red boxes are attacks
Hollow Green boxes are vulnerable to strikes and projectiles
Hollow Red boxes are vulnerable too, but are immune to projectiles
Solid Blue boxes are throw attempts
Hollow Blue boxes are vulnerable only to throws.
Solid Yellow boxes cannot pass through eachother. These are why you cannot walk through your opponent’s character.

If an Attack box touches a Vulnerable box, you hit your opponent.
If an Attack box touches another Attack box, OR if both characters touch Attack to Vulnerable boxes on the same frame, the priority system is checked to see who wins or if there is a trade.
For throws, A Throw box must touch a Throw Vulnerable for a throw to trigger.

You may also see Solid Tan boxes – these force the opponent to block if they are holding back, and are known as Force Block or Proximity Guard boxes.
Solid Pink boxes - Kan-Ra has a bunch of these. They are active Attack boxes that you cannot trade with, so they don’t double as vulnerable boxes.
Light Green Boxes - You’ll see these on projectiles, but you may also see a Projectile Destroy box attached to a character that is a similar color.

Hope this helps.

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"Ground shaking and loud thunderous boom"
Did you hear that? That was my head exploding…LOL

Thanks Keits…I really need to learn this stuff…along with frame data

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I must admit, although I’m pleased this has been stated, I have no idea what you’re on about with the numbers etc.

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Cool, didn’t know what the pink boxes were for. They’re also on combo breakers. I thought they were unblockable attacks sometimes (because combo breakers could not be blocked) but they were also on some blockable attacks so I didn’t know.

I know there’s a dojo leson on hitboxes, but it’s been a long time since I’ve done it - is this info covered there? If not, I think it should be covered somewhere where it’s more likely to become common knowledge, because I’ve been wondering about a lot of those…

They are pink on combo breakers because we never want a combo breaker to trade. :slight_smile:

I was trying to find a way to express the priority system in numerical terms, since it is easy to relate the concept of one move beating another to one number being higher than the another. If we look at the priority system in this way then: Light Medium Heavy Special Shadow is equal to 1 2 3 4 5. If the move is aerial rather than grounded then it has 1 less priority, so a jumping heavy kick actually would have 2 priority instead of 3. This means that the highest priority move is a grounded shadow move at 5 priority, and the lowest is a jumping light punch or kick at 0.

Had to sit down and think this through for a few minutes, but I think I understand it now though applying the priority system ina match would be tricky :smiley:

You don’t really think about it during a match, you think about it before a match when studying your character’s tools. Crouch fierce anti-airs are extra good, because they will beat or trade with every attack if you time it correctly. Fierce buttons have extra worth in footsies and during frame traps (like Jago’s fwd+HK), so you might prioritize using them a bit. Stuff like that.

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