Gameplay/strategy question

use a jumping overhead

ANd dont forget we are talking hard knockdown 50/50…so they are either going to block on wake up or mash buttons. EIther way you win if you guess correctly


Nice, ill have to give it a shot. I notice I can get away with it sometimes especially when they are constantly crouch blocking like you said, but I have discovered that if I just run up and throw it out I get stuffed a lot lol ill try to remember this next time I play though.

And yeah man I love the heavy punch move, the range is so good and not a lot of people I come across seem to expect me to just toss it out there from its max range, and then I can follow up with the shield linker and get a decent combo.

@FallofSeraphs76: Quick question, are all jump in attacks overheads? Or only if they are from a neutral jump?

Yea it is pretty great. I was reading over your original post and was wondering if you would mind posting your run cancel move that you have been practicing that bass does. I think I get what your doing but if I were to see I think it would help me a lot as I also want to learn some run cancel moves. I also want to try and integrate in that HK option that Banemobius mentioned. I feel like this a huge part of his game plan that I’m not taking advantage of.

Oh the run cancel thing I saw bass doing? It really isn’t a move/combo, its just the standing hp, run, and into his throw/grab move. I see Bass do it a lot so I thought it was something I need to start doing too lol

You can see it in this video multiple times, and I think once around the 3:15 mark. After watching again though it doesn’t seem its the standing HP, but its definitely one of his standing punch moves - run - grab. At the 3 minute mark it actually looks like he did it out of a crouching lp (or mp). The standing HP one does work though, I have been trying to use it lately and it works.

Thanks for the post! I actually have this in my watch later lol. Watching all of his most recent videos. I will have to experiment in the lab with this. Looks to be tricky but very effective.

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Ha! Got it. Thanks can’t wait to try this out online! Medium punch also works couldn’t get the light to come out though.

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if they are crouch blocking yes…it hits over head. Its a high attack so a low block can only block low attacks.

And of course all this works best in the corner after a hard knock down…so you can start your 50/50 …just like you see in MKX!!

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This might be a dumb question. Wouldn’t someone just quick block high as soon as they see them jump into the air?

Awesome. I know overheads crush low blocking opponents, but I wasn’t sure if all jumping attacks count as overheads or not lol thanks for clearing that up for me

Not if you time your jump just right before the get up. You just have to play around with it man… get em in the corner and to the 50/50

Plus you dont have to attack off the neutral jump…make them think you are gonna jump attack but just fall back down and grab them

its that simple…mix in some throws and you figure it all out.

the corner is the key

Ah gotcha great advice. Much appreciated. What’s the best way to get the hard knockdown? launcher ender? Also kind of an unrelated question, how do you quick rise? When working on my shadow its always at 0 percent and whenever I get knocked down I mash buttons and don’t seem to get up any faster.

This is something I have been meaning to ask for a while too. I beleive somebody said you just press one of the attack buttons as soon as you hit the ground but I tried that and like you, my Quick Rise percent in Shadow Lab is still at 0 lol

Well at least I’m not the only one. I at this point don’t even bother but it does annoy me seeing that 0 percent and while I have the chance I mine as well ask player with more experience than I do.

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THe throw is a hard knock down and the launcher ender

quick rise has always been a mystery to me. IN infills guide it says just to hit any button as soon as you land…like in MK X how it makes you “roll” up quickly.

as for the shadow stats…Im not sure if thats working properly so you cant tell with that.

but you can only quick rise form a “soft knockdown” not a hard knock down.

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Thanks for the kind words @FallofSeraphs76 .

Easiest way I found to quickrise is to hold up, doesn’t require specific timing or anything.

Your fastest buttons are standing or crouching LP and crouching LK, they all start on frame 5. Stand LK is 1 frame slower at 6f and crouch MP is 7f, these should be used if you need a touch more range.

90% of aerial attacks are overheads, Spinal’s divekick being a notable exception that you can block either way. The best way to use Spinal’s overhead is from a distance so you step in to attack, this way you can more likely avoid the opponent pressing a faster button.

That is a link to my frame data table for Spinal which includes a section on run cancels, basically to make run cancel combos just make sure the manuals value of the normal you want to combo into is equal to or less than the rc hit value of the move you are run cancelling. There is a notes section on the last tab which explains the table but if anything is unclear please ask. (Edit: oh wow it shows up in the browser now too, excellent).

In work so can’t check thoroughly but think that’s everything, if I missed a question or you have any more please let me know and I will answer how I can.


LOL @Blade4693 @CrimsonGhost119

I told you he would blow your mind!! I hope your good at math and spread sheets! But this is going to make you great if you can implement int o your game.


Wow thanks man, it might take me a while to understand it but at least now I have a place I can keep coming back to for reference lol like I said I really don’t “get” frame data all that much yet, but I am working on it :slight_smile:

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This is much appreciated thank you for the detailed response. I was actually checking this out in one of your other posts in the spinal forums. Thanks for taking the time to create this I will for sure do my best to take advantage of the information.


Yea pretty much mind blown I’m awful at math but I am passionate about KI and always willing to learn more. Especially if it’s got anything to do with spinal. Thanks to all of you for being so reponsive and willing to help. This is what makes the KI community so great!