3.8 suggested changes for Fulgore

patch
rebalance
fulgore
Tags: #<Tag:0x00007f74af8e64a0> #<Tag:0x00007f74af8e6360> #<Tag:0x00007f74af8e6220>
#121

really? then why am I able to meaty heavy into light lazer into heavy manual, into medium kick manual into whatever?

#122

oh, on block. I apologize good sir. carry on. I’ll try to throw up a few vids so u can see what I mean. when people start throwing around frame data I usually take it with some salt. 90 percent of the time that person is incorrect.

#123

What… no Sadira? :frowning: cries

:smiley:

#124

her play style changed too much into juggles :frowning: i do not like juggling at all lol

#125

You aren’t able to do that. Frame data on hit or on block doesn’t change online at all

1 Like
#126

heart officially broken. :stuck_out_tongue:

#127

k. if u guys say so. I must be mistaken then. but just for safe measures I’ll try and post a few vids and maybe you guys can tel me what’s going on.

#128

Please do :thumbsup:

#129

Alright, my baby Fulgore is ready to go. @Paramisery, @shellshock520, and anybody else let me know whenever you want to fight it.

#130

Alright, maybe this weekend, I really haven’t been playing much lately though, staying away from both the game and these forums has really improved my mood. Storm179 on Xbox too?

#131

Yeah, I play on X1.

#132

I’m down to fight your baby fulgore with my baby jago sometime :stuck_out_tongue:

#133

Haha, cool beans. Just hit me up in the GG’s Thread whenever you want to play.

That goes for everyone actually - probably shouldn’t clutter up this thread with any more matchmaking stuff :sweat_smile:

#134

If I see you on my gargis would like to fight your bot👍

1 Like
#135

While I’m still very curious to see what you’ve come up with Storm, unless something changes with 3.8 I’m definitely done with this character. I decided to play a few games yesterday and in one, I got my ■■■ royally handed to me for my first lifebar. That said, I had just gotten my second pip when I lost my first bar, and the only thought on my mind was, “well, this is completely over.”

Sure Fulgore can do anything with meter, but right now if you’re losing hard, you really should just quit. You’re only going to continue to not get meter, you get an instinct that is useless if your opponent is still up in your face, and you inherently have lower than average damage.

I get that people have their opinions on comeback mechanics, but when every single other character in the game at least gets meter for getting hit and most of them have useful instinct modes too its like, even if I DO start to make a comeback, their character is about to become twice the threat they currently are while I’m stuck in the same place.

Anyway, I shouldn’t post after I play, or maybe like I said before I just shouldn’t play (not easy to quit though).

#136

Haha. Again, don’t expect either greatness or anything particularly special. I’ve simply been playing a very basic Fulgore, where I don’t rely on energy system mixups in general and use resets and maximized lockouts to get damage. It’s not that I’m coming up with anything new - I’ve simply been playing the character with an eye towards building meter so that I can strengthen my neutral and offense as needed.

I am available today if you’d like to play though @Paramisery. Just let me know when (again, preferably through the GG’s thread so we don’t clutter this one any more) and I’ll hop.

#137

@Paramisery @SullenMosquito
So played some more Fulgore yesterday, and ran a set with another pro star Hisako that I think shows how you can run an effective Fulgore without relying on energy systems.

Learning Fulgore FT10:

After having played around with the character a decent bit now, I think I feel pretty confident in saying that if you don’t have meter while playing as Fulgore, then you are largely choosing to not have meter. Fulgore can be played quite effectively without relying hardly at all on energy systems, so if meter is something you prize then you have a lot of opportunity to get it, even in a fight that isn’t going super well. Even in my worst case matches (getting dunked whole first round, fighting Spinal) I’ve found I always end my first lifebar with at least 4 pips, and usually have 7-8 by the time I take my opponent’s first bar.

I will say it again - meter building is a choice with Gore. If you want it, you can get it. You don’t have to turn every throw into a fireball/teleport mixup, and you don’t have to always pressure with lasers. Fulgore has good lows, a solid overhead, and deceptive throw range - he’s more than capable of opening up the opponent without murdering his spin speed.

My baby Gore has thus far done pretty well without using his vortex at all - think of how much damage you could do with a healthy balance between vortex/pip cancels and standard pressure :hushed:

2 Likes
#138

Just finished watching your video very carefully.
First of all, thank you for your effort to show us amateurs/beginners your point of view offering interesting sparks.

Now, let me say I loved your approach, the finest example of how learning the basics must be prior to exploring each characters’ peculiarity. It was truly inspirational and definitely shows the direction I want to follow when it comes to improving my gameplay.

This said… I don’t think this video can be considered a solid argument for your “meter bulding is a choice with Gore” thesis.
Let me clarify, I agree with this statement in principle, the Fulgore player’s match interpretation has a sure impact on meter building, and indeed you have built meter consistently throughout the set but in my opinion, there are evident biases which helped you in this regard:

  1. Your opponent respected you waaay to much
  2. Your opponent has missed tons of easy punishes
  3. Your opponent ate the same stuff over and over again

By no means I want to judge the player skill, it was clearly a training set with easy atmosphere, maybe he just didn’t take it seriously (which is absolutely legit). But no way you could build meter so fast by standing neutral, be allowed so many jump-ins in a more tensed match.
In a nutshell, it wasn’t only your choice, even Hisako chose to let you build meter like that :wink:

I still think that the best, most efficient Fulgore, the one that perfectly conjugates mixups, technique and meter management is Wheels. The following set above is a testament to me.

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#139

Without even watching the set (will definitely get to it though!) I can say that I 100% believe that Dayton has a fantastic Fulgore - he’s a great player with any character he chooses, and I’ve no doubt his Fulgore puts mine to shame. He approaches all his characters with a scary mix of solid play and shenanigans, and has an uncanny sense of when to bring out each.

But I actually would like to examine the problem statements that you listed above. I think there’s probably a great discussion in there :slight_smile:

So let’s start here. What are some instances of Undead giving me too much respect? When and where in the set do they occur, and is there any underlying context that might help explain this reaction from him? Are any of these instances of respect actually baiting (from either side)? Are any of them actually questions of reactability?

Not saying your assertion here is wrong, just want to unpack it a bit. Please provide some examples of where you think Undead erred, and let’s talk about it a bit.

I noted in the stream a few areas where he could have punished bigger, and noted some additional punishes he could have started applying when I watched the set myself, but curious what you’re referring to. Let’s talk about these “tons” of easy punishes that he missed - what are some examples?

Which stuff, and why? It is an undeniable fact that he got hit by many of the same things multiple times, but that’s going to happen (to both sides) in any extended set. I think the more interesting question is why he might have gotten hit by some of the same things repeatedly.

As before, give me some examples of some things you think my opponent got dunked by too many times, and then let’s dive into some of those things. Was the mixup reactable? What does him getting hit by it reveal about his play? Was he getting hit because he was trying to avoid some other mixup? Why might he have been afraid of this other mixup, and was that fear a result of anything else that might have occurred within the set?

Without knowing what examples you will choose, it could be that yes, my opponent just wasn’t serious or was perhaps playing badly. On the other hand, I find it equally likely that there is perhaps more going on in these individual interactions than you might think.

Not 100% sure I get the full meaning of the statement here, but I will stand up for my opponent on this - he anti-aired me very well for the vast majority of the set, and when he didn’t, it was mostly because the spaces I was jumping into are difficult to deal with as Sako. On a list of flaws in his play, I actually wouldn’t consider AA’s to be one of them.

Looking forward to your response man - like I said, I think there’s a very interesting discussion to be had here :smile:

#140

I do apologize in advance for the “scatterplot” style of my answer and poor synthax. Just don’t have a lot of time and it’s weekend :airplane: so I hope you’ll understand.

Recurring problem during the set: dropped combos. A lot. Most of them were due to noticeable lag issues, not the player’s fault but still they had an impact on the set’s development.

5:00 whiff dp, no punish. Pretty sure it happened other times, like at 25:50. I know your playstile during the set made him fear dps and throws (and it’s definitely a benchmark for me, very inspirational to watch), but surely he could have punished more.

10:06 most of your jump ins were very smart, but others like this are quite easy to AA or block. As a matter of fact, when he catches your next try at 10:28, you say to yourself “stop jumping”. Yet at 10:53 he gets hit again. 16:50 and 18:47 are other examples even though corner pressure might have played a role here.

I took this quote because a blocked blade dash is -2 at best as well, and it also has more pushback which is a good thing for Hisako because it’s a perfect set for her fast, long reaching medium normals (I could be wrong though.)

Yet let’s look at how many times “it actually was your turn again”:

between 6:40 and 6:47 missed counters allowed you to increase spin speed while you should have been landed 2 to 3 openers by him.

7:57 another post-blade dash whiffed punish, in this case you were out of range for a throw. This happened other times, like at 18:20. Curiously, look at how much pips you have when you lose the lead at the beginning of the match (18:20). This is what most people complain about when it comes to meter. Your skill and expertise allow you a fast comeback, but casual to amateur players are not likely to get out of these kind of situations consistently, I know it’s difficult for you to get in our pants, and for sure it’s something that can be overcome with dedication and practice, but until we reach a decent level, getting rushed down with a meter bar as empty as a North Korean Restaurant in Seoul can be frustrating, trust me :wink:

10:41 I don’t think your opponent countered any of your charged blade dashes. 16:50 made me doubt that could be somehow unbreakable, so I went to the lab to verify before writing it. There’s another example at 28:34.

Could go on, but I think I have provided enough points of discussion for now.

Bottom line: seeing you play was very inspirational, I want to try your approach myself and I agree that Fulgore choices play an important role on meter building frequency, just… not that overwhelmingly much as your video seems to show.

Have a splendid weekend!