3.8 Patch Notes


I feel like Fulgore got hit too hard with nerfs. Idk it doesn’t look like he’ll be that much fun anymore.


Not gonna lie. I now feel a little intimidated to punish people who are not blocking my cyper uppercut wake up. Especially if they can just tap my foot. I think on the defensive side this just means I’ll have to find another way to deal with defenses. I don’t mind the laser nerfs though.

Only one way to find out though. On the other hand might make sadira a pain but hey, I don’t even try to anti-air her anymore. lol

I personally don’t mind the ability to not pip cncel during shadow counters. It’s not like I’ve ever been lucky enough to do that anyway, lol. Just missing with light DP is really why I never used it much.


Well the light version is still fully invincible. It’s just the other versions that can be stuffed so you don’t really have to change anything other than the strength you use during those situations.


Light DP is great but considering I wanna make SURE I hit my opponent I think I have a choice between getting hit at the start of my anti-air or missing cause the attack doesn’t go far enough.That’s pretty much what I see so far. But that may change with time. But who knows, maybe the vulnerabilities are still breif enough to stuff the jump in.

HOWEVER the only possible explanation for this is Fulgore’s Medium and Heavy Cyber Uppercuts all do 2-3 hits respectively. So I guess that might be fair.

Either way I think I’ll try to use cyber uppercut less until I’m sure I know where I am right now. To my other fulgore players just clinch your butts and get in there. Despite the vulnerabilities put in, I’m still sticken’ with Fulgore.


If I recall, the Fulgore dp nerf was also a slight nerf to air shadow laser as it is harder to do it from light dp.


Well in anti air situations they’ll still be effective being a 3 frame move with special move priority. It’s only in those late antiairs where it might ■■■■■ you over.


The bot nerffs are BS just goes to show you that if you get on this forum and complain instead of learning IG will change things what a joke this has turned into.


Poor Thunder, no real dp, crappy jump, get destroyed by zonners and they keep nerfing him.


I don’t really see people complain about Fulgore much on these forums. Usually it’s asking for Sadira/Kan-Ra/Wulf buffs. Which they didn’t do. So there you go :slight_smile:


As they were making a few larger changes to MU’s that she has problems with, it kind of made since for them to leave Sadira alone this time around.

While I’d love for her to be top tier again. I don’t want her to get buffed, just to get nerfed again.


I both like and dislike that Gargos’s Minions no longer do chip damage.

I dislike it the same reason @Infilament dislikes it. Minions are a shadow moves and generally shadow moves do good chip damage. Also If you allow Gargos to get two minions to apply pressure on you, that is partially your fault and you should be punished for it.

HOWEVER, I do like the change when watching tournament play. There have been lots of occasions when a Gargos is zoning and chips out the opponent lifebar and it kinda deflates all the hype because there is nothing the opponent can do.


He is now fine where he is at. Gargos players will still be able to do all there crazy resets, minions, and fly away. He just wont hit as hard and he wont be able to spam JMP as easily.

Just like everyone else…he is fine where is is at now. :wink: Now maybe Omen can hang with him on the damage end…indirect buffs for Omen everyone YAY!


I agree that the patch video should show the change in action. You can show it side-by-side, showing how it was prior to the patch and how it is now. Showing unrelated gameplay is useless.


We will! I love the fact that Gargos will have to work a little harder to keep Sadira out.


For the record, I respect you for that. You can keep your possibly non-existent tears.




Having slept on the changes and listen to Infil’s analysis, i wanna put out my thoughts on this too.

Jago - It almost feels like for me, there’s no real reason to harp against Jago’s instinct healing. I’ve long disliked it but never really thought of a way to make it balanced. Now? Jago has to work to find his way into, at least a L windkick range where he can make good use of his plus normals, fireball dash cancels and laser sword to open you up. That is not going to not come without risk or incurring damage, which kinda balances the still absurd amount of life he can regenerate. He’s also gonna have to change his way in. Gone are things like jump in normal, cr. mk for plus into a few good options, including another cr. mk. Essentially, if and when Jago works his way it, he’ll have earned it and it’s on the opposing player to shut him down.

Thunder - On paper, he now feels a little less gimmicky, but no less scary. As Infil pointed out, nothing really changed about his dominating ranges where he can move in and attack you or grab you. He’s just now a bit more punishable. The priority changes to Sammamish followups is nice but for my money, Murder of Crows dash changes are where it’s at. I don’t follow all the initial ‘RIP ITAMaster’ stuff, Thunder is now bottom tier, whatever. That’s nonsense. Thunder is still dominant and can vortex you on YOUR wakeup. He’s just not as hard to pin down on HIS wakeup.

Fulgore - The teleport VFX change is interesting because of the wording. Almost sounds like they wanted to change it even more than what is being done. Or maybe i’m reading too much into it, but any change to this, i will happily and graciously accept. The rest of the changes suprised me, though. Since the 3.6 didnt fully implement the instinct changes they wanted and 3.7 did, i figured they’d let the bot breathe awhile in 3.8. I’m kinda up and down on losing pip cancel on shadow counters. There’s like a handful of characters that can beat a shadow counter (Fulgore, Kim, Hisako) so it was a quirk you had to account for playing them. That made it interesting and i like that. But it is VERY powerful to burn an opponent’s bar for 1 pip, damage and a knockdown with a healthy window to do so.

Even more so now than before, i feel like the best use for Fulgore’s instinct is to use his pip charge mechanics.

Hisako - I did not know about this jump arc thing, and nearly every Hisako i know of uses a wall jump once a match. Having looked at it, that feels like a huge change especially against non DP characters that take a risk AA’ing into a possible Air On Ryo Zan.

Shadow Jago - I mean, the immediate thought is that his overhead can go into DP, but there’s other ways Shago can utilize being only -2 after his overhead. Is his now the least negative overhead in the game? I wanna say most are at least -3…

Rash - I feel like Rash is becoming a footsies monster on the down low. St. HP? I feel like it’s way better than even Jago’s forward roundhouse. And for a Rash that realizes it, that makes his approach a bit easier and safer. He is going to be stupid ridiculous right around that 1 character length range, even more than he is now. Sure, he’s less advantaged on block for some other normals, but that one forward advancing, +2 on block normal equalizes it. Tongue and wrecking ball approach might now be the least of your worries, at least those are punishable…

Oh, and Big Bad Boot? Much needed and appreciated. I’ll take being slower if the hitbox is going to remain the same.

Gargos - The cr. MP is the biggest thing, and i like where they have it now. It ought to be a plus move, but i’m more intrigued with the pushback on hit and block. How many can he now get away with before they’re out of range? 2? 3?

Shin Hisako - I. Have. No. Idea. Shinsako is rare in my playing time so i have no idea how her bug fixes and changes will affect her and her MU’s.

And for my money, I don’t really mind them not showing changes in patch videos. They’re coming in a week anyway. From a work standpoint, why invest that much into capture, recording, timing and setup for a video that has literally no longevity once the patch comes?





So that begs the question: do you guys want the game patched or not? Do you want degenerate strategies toned down that you and others have been complaining about or not?

You can’t have your cake and eat it too.


The biggest problem that people don’t understand with the fulgore nerfs is what they mean for his meter gain. Fulgore cannot increase his spin speed without physical attacks. Now that he’s lost max spin speed in instinct last patch, and loses his turn after most normals now, it’s physically impossible to increase reactor without opening your opponent up now. He WILL NOT have meter for shadow counters, cannot pip cancel enemy shadow counters, and only has light DP to protect him from pressure? How do you all not see this as crippling? Further, even if he blocks correctly, that too wrecks his reactor speed. His wake up being worse further destroys any hope of meter.

His zoning is overrated now too. It was great when he had the meter for it, but he genuinely doesn’t have any reliable way to build spin speed. His zoning damage is also horribly nerfed, if he hits all three fireballs it costs him two pips and lowers his reactor speed 3 times - and due to scaling it does less damage than Jago’s regular uncharged fireball, which BUILDS him meter if it connects.

If fulgore had normal meter gain these changes would probably be fine, but because of his reactor he’s definitely a dead character now. I seriously challenge anyone who thinks he’s good to see what it’s like to play him for a week.