Another thing I just remembered: ANY strength of the club’s recapture can be broken with ANY strength of breaker. Give him three different air normals, or at least some TJ Tremor trails so that it’s not an automatic 50/50 break.
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I agree with just about everything LeoFerrels mentioned. Having a club is also basically a disadvantage when the opponent is close.
Here’s a thought: If you have a club and “chunk up,” maybe it can have a different animation that chunks up faster but still destroys the club. It would just be another option and a way to regain the chunk used to get the club in the first place.
It’s less so that he’s big and hulking, and moreso that he has the walls mechanic. If that’s not something to explicitly point to a character who’s not intended to be at long range, I don’t know what is.
What about this. If Aganos has a chunk and press…
Back+3P: places a wall behind himself
Forward+3P: places a wall behind the rival
3P: Gets a club in his hand directly
This would make easier to get a club in neutral, as far as you only need one chunk. This would not be the only change: from the Op, at least 1 and 3 seems viable to me
Even more:
The peacemaker has less hurtbox, so a simple jab couldn’t trade hits with it
If Aganos has a chunk and press…
Back+3P: places a wall behind himself
Forward+3P: places a wall behind the rival
3P: Gets a club in his hand directly
If Aganos has a peacemaker and press…
Back+3P: places a wall behind himself, consuming the peacemaker
Forward+3P: places a wall behind the rival, consuming the peacemaker
3P: Uses the peacemaker to gain a chunk. Optional: maybe make this animation faster than normal re-chunk.
(This part it’s a direct buff to both peacemaker in normal and his instinct, giving him access to more walls AND chunks during his instinct)
If Aganos uses a special move while holding the peacemaker, he consumes the peacemaker BUT the special move has 1 point of armor during all it’s frames.
This gives him more options when cornered with a peacemaker in hand, using for example pulverize or natural disaster to punish jump attempts more easily.
Now comes the most polemical part: Should he retain the peacemaker when he recieve a hit?
Options:
a) No, stays the same
b) Yes, you should use the peacemaker at your will, not get hit and maybe you don’t have the chance of spam another one for full instinct duration
c) Yes, but with conditions. Give it durability as it has when attacking. A new peacemaker should have 3 hits of durability. Any combo should destroy it. A single projectile counts the same as a hit with the club to a enemy, so you could be hit by a fireball and still have the peacemaker.
Conclusion:
-During instinct, Aganos can place a lot of walls and gain a lot of chunks, his main indentity and core design mechanics
-Obtaining a peacemaker it’s easier in neutral, and you have more uses for it, threatening the rival with a high priority projectile OR more walls around him OR more armor for Aganos
-Both instinct and neutral peacemaker gains a new option very needed for Aganos: a new defensive tool. An extra point of armor when using the peacemaker means that you WANT a peacemaker in your hands when you have no chunks
@LeoFerreis, what do you think about this suggested changes? As the OP of this thread I’m very interested in your opinion, you suggested really good ideas for the peacemaker
Well, as I mentioned in the OP, the two ways to make the club more effective are to 1) make it easier to obtain and/or (probably “or” for it to be balanced) 2) make it better when it’s in his possession. I’m much more in favor of the latter for a couple of reasons.
First, I think it would be too easy to keep characters like Thunder and Sabrewulf out if Aganos could quickly obtain a club by pressing 3P. It would feel kind of “cheap”, in my opinion. Second, I think it Ruins what’s cool about normally getting a club: you tear a wall out of the ground and beat someone with it! The only way anyone would get a club would then be by it just appearing in his hand (or pulling it out of his chest, maybe?) just like in Instinct, which isn’t nearly as cool and a little bit random. As for buffs, which would most likely come at the cost of NOT getting clubs easier:
Yes, I think there should be some kind of direct reciprocity between clubs and chunks. Aganos is probably the most resource-dependent character in the game, but his Instinct doesn’t help much in replenishing it. Being able to exchange a club for a chunk (or wall) would alleviate that.
Adding a hit of armor to a special is an interesting idea. The club would essentially be a 5th chunk, meaning you have plenty of reason to have one in hand. But you might also not have a reason to NOT have a club. I don’t know, should he ALWAYS want to have one? Maybe. But it might make his actual normals pretty obsolete, especially if clubs came more easily.
If it didn’t reduce his up-close and anti-air options, I’d be all for keeping it after getting hit… or if he got a Rocksplosion reversal to make up for that loss, as I’ve mentioned. Otherwise, if I’m knocked down or placed into a defensive position and have to defend a jump-in without meter, I definitely don’t want it in my hand.
And in regards to its hurtbox, it doesn’t extend it, unlike Glacius’ moves. It comes down to the collision of hitboxes, where any special beats a normal, which the club is. Regardless of any other buffs, I think it’s essential that its priority is ranked up so that it beats specials. Basically, it should get the opposite treatment of Cinder’s Trailblazer, which loses to everything.